MattW wrote:I'm against public financing sports venues. I'm just trying to make the point that both the Twins and Vikings hosed taxpayers. The Twins just hosed us less.
Regarding attendance. US Banks stadium will be used for many more things than Vikings football. I did pull the 10k figure out of my ass but I say it'd be pretty fair to assume that across all events, 20 or less will pull more than 10k people.
Yes, you are against public finance of sports venues. I get that. Do you get that you lost on that issue, that its a historical event, its time to move on, and that its better to judge events on their own merits? Also, do you get that to the extent you have that issue, its with your elected leaders and not the franchises? The sports teams, including the Vikings, only do what pro sports teams do. Its for politicians to decide if they want to have that dance. In Minnesota's case, the politicians chose to dance. Put that in the loss column and move on. (We all have wins and losses in life)
The legal term for judging an activity based on determinations you bring into a forum is "prejudice". You made your point, you lost. Regardless, it has nothing to do with whether the Vikings intellectual property rights are being infringed wrt Wells Fargo. You color a separate current activity with an asked and answered event and then draw your conclusions from that coloring - going so far as to read out of the equation relevant facts that suggest a serious lack of fairness in your position. I have no problem with being opposed to tax-payer financed sports facilities. I do have a problem with folks who hold those ideas and then not accepting (often in full denial) that the opportunity cost of that position is the loss of top tier professional sports franchises. I think the Vikings dodged a bullet and had the owners been other than the Wilfs, this team might be in LA.
You made your point. You keep making your point. When its relevant, keep doing it. Oakland isn't going to finance a new stadium, the Raiders may leave. The Rams did leave. And the Chargers are discussing in earnest a new stadium. NFL teams have that leverage. But when all you have is a hammer, it doesn't mean everything about the U.S. Bank Stadium, the Vikings, and the Wilfs is a nail.
Neither the Vikings nor the Twins (nor the Wild nor the T-Wolves) hosed any taxpayer. At the Minnesota state, county and city level, politicians knew that to keep a sports team in a mid-sized market, they had to pay up. At the end of the day, they chose to pay up. As they are lawfully elected, the Vikings (and Twins, and Wild, and T-Wolves) got what they needed through lawful negations with elected representative of the people who had the authority to act. I get that you don't agree with it. I don't have a problem with that. But whether its the owners of the Vikings, Twins, T-Wolves (all in MPLS), there are no credible allegations of wrongdoing, bribery or anything like that. In each case, the teams bargained above board and in good faith for what they got with government executives (from Mayor to Governor) and legislators (from City Council to State Legislature) who had the legal authority to act - and who acted to lawfully subsidize sports facilities as the cost of retaining those franchises. As Humphrey once said, without the Vikings and the Twins, the Twin Cities would just be another Omaha, NE. From a national market presence perspective, that's obviously true.
The difference is that of all the owners, only the Wilfs get separated out for such intense sustained vitriolic hatred.
As already noted, there were more than a few politicians who knew they would get accolades for standing up to stop a new stadium from the same voter who they knew would also be run out of town the day after the Vikings left and the realization began to burn in - don't kid yourself. (The Metrodome wasn't just among the lowest revenue generating facilities in the NFL, it was in its own category of unprofitable.) Besides, the U.S. Bank Stadium has already caused an unparalleled construction boom in the area around it - that to that point was a tax-dollar-sucking blight - that already promises a net new tax stream that will easily offset initial investments over time.
Also, it will be the U.S. Bank Stadium that brings in large national and nationally televised audiences that put Minneapolis on the national and international sports and tourism map.