North Loop Neighborhood

[Silophant]

And they're just restoring it on spec? Cool!

[5th Ave Guy]

I'm glad it's being restored as is and not swallowed up as the base of a condo tower or a hotel. This corner has certainly taken a dramatic turn.

[MNdible]

Callooh! Callay!

Whoever's undertaking this should be carried down Washington Avenue hoisted upon shoulders.

[grant1simons2]

John Rimarcik!

[EOst]

Hard to find two more significant names in the history of Minneapolis than Thomas Lowry and Clinton Morrison, and this was already one of my favorite buildings in the city. So very glad to see this surprisingly thorough restoration moving forward at last.

[jtoemke]

This was my "If I had ten million dollars" building. I hope it is restored with historic sensitivity

[grant1simons2]

I can't believe this is still a problem for retailers in a dense downtown neighborhood...

While there has been interest because of the location, the area’s biggest challenge for commercial tenants is the limited parking in the neighborhood, he said.

http://www.startribune.com/minneapolis- ... 405089596/

[Silophant]

This building is 1.5 blocks from Ramp C. It would be nice if everyone that makes this complaint was upfront and honest that they're whining about a lack of free parking, not an absolute lack of parking.

[grant1simons2]

P r i v i l e g e

[MNdible]

Your bubble is showing.

I don't think people are terribly worried about free parking in a location like this, but I also don't think that the C Ramp is a very realistic option for serving retail in the North Loop. Like much of downtown, there's a lot of parking, but it's either not public, or it's not obvious that it's public.

If you're convenience retail and you can make it off of people who are within just a few blocks of your location, then parking isn't a big deal. If you're serving a regional market, as many of the specialty retailers in the North Loop are, then it is a big deal.

[amiller92]

If you're serving a regional market, as many of the specialty retailers in the North Loop are, then it is a big deal.

So, they're successful and growing, but there's something wrong with the existing parking situation?

[mattaudio]

Also, regional amenities = good. Regional parking provision = bad?

[QuietBlue]

So, they're successful and growing, but there's something wrong with the existing parking situation?

The specific "they" makes a difference. The situation as is won't necessarily work for every business (not that it has to).

[amiller92]

Sure, although to be honest, I think MNdible has it exactly backwards. Things that are a regional draw will draw and people will figure out where to park. Things that aren't (dry cleaner, chain coffee shop, pharmacy, etc) will suffer if there isn't immediately available parking because there's another one of those things right on down the road.

[EOst]

I don't know how the finances of higher-end restaurants really work, but I imagine their clientele skews older, whiter, and wealthier than the general population. Each of those correlates with higher car ownership and suburban living. I don't think it's unreasonable for these businesses to worry about the availability of parking, then, when equivalent suburban establishments are for their target audience both 1) more convenient to park at and 2) frequently closer overall.

At any rate, we can tell restauranteurs not to worry about parking, but the banks and institutions which finance those restaurants are still going to be risk-averse.

[amiller92]

I don't know how the finances of higher-end restaurants really work, but I imagine their clientele skews older, whiter, and wealthier than the general population. Each of those correlates with higher car ownership and suburban living.

Typically higher-end restaurants offer a valet service for those who don't want to find their own parking.

[MNdible]

So, they're successful and growing, but there's something wrong with the existing parking situation?

I think there is an emerging problem with the parking situation as more businesses are opening up in this area. People are willing to pay for parking, to a certain extent. I know that Matt will say that if the street meters charged $10/hour, there would be plenty of parking around, but that's really not terribly helpful for the real situation on the ground.

As I was trying to allude to in my comments above, what the area probably needs is a public ramp that actively markets itself to transitory users. Most of the surface lots in the area now are primarily targeted at day-time contract users, and may or may not accommodate evening public use, but even if they allow it, it's not terribly obvious and the method of payment isn't intuitive.

[MNdible]

Sure, although to be honest, I think MNdible has it exactly backwards. Things that are a regional draw will draw and people will figure out where to park. Things that aren't (dry cleaner, chain coffee shop, pharmacy, etc) will suffer if there isn't immediately available parking because there's another one of those things right on down the road.

You can slice this up a lot of different ways. My theory was that a dry cleaner or coffee shop in the North Loop should be able to survive with effectively no parking, since they can get enough walk-up customers from the immediate area.

If you're a regional draw type retailer or high end restaurant, you may gamble that your product is so compelling that people will find you even in an inconvenient location, or you may choose to move to a more convenient (if slightly less hip) location. Which is exactly the point that the original quote was trying to make.

[RailBaronYarr]

As I was trying to allude to in my comments above, what the area probably needs is a public ramp that actively markets itself to transitory users. Most of the surface lots in the area now are primarily targeted at day-time contract users, and may or may not accommodate evening public use, but even if they allow it, it's not terribly obvious and the method of payment isn't intuitive.

Not that I legitimately think that the private market can solve every problem in the universe, but...

I'll preface this by saying I have literally never had a hard time parking in the North Loop visiting my brother who lived there for multiple years, going to Acme, doing work business during the week, etc - but I also don't try to park during Twins games. But. If parking was really in such demand (and I believe at times it is)... There *are* private ramps. Maybe these business owners are bad at their job and don't understand how a bit of marketing and signage and marginal labor/operating costs could go a long way for a lot of money on their part. If so, I guess I'd rather the city use their team of parking staff to help private ramps see the light than the city buying or dedicating more land in a desirable neighborhood toward (expensive) structured parking that doesn't pay property taxes and may not even turn an operating profit. And instead of all that money building a ramp, the city could do some actual public infrastructure projects to make walking to/from ramps: 1) direct (a few key connections might be needed), 2) well-lit, 3) open 24/7, 4) have some way-finding. Maybe some dollars could be spent on quality transit shelters to make taking the bus in the area a little more attractive.

[dajazz]

I think there is an emerging problem with the parking situation as more businesses are opening up in this area. People are willing to pay for parking, to a certain extent. I know that Matt will say that if the street meters charged $10/hour, there would be plenty of parking around, but that's really not terribly helpful for the real situation on the ground.

As I was trying to allude to in my comments above, what the area probably needs is a public ramp that actively markets itself to transitory users. Most of the surface lots in the area now are primarily targeted at day-time contract users, and may or may not accommodate evening public use, but even if they allow it, it's not terribly obvious and the method of payment isn't intuitive.

For better or worse parking is only going to be more limited over the coming years in the North Loop. Just looking at the 12 block section between Hennepin, Washington and the train tracks you'll have lost the following surface lots from the :

• Hennepin & 1st Street - becoming the Maverick
  1st & 1st - becoming townhomes
  2nd St & 1st/2nd (behind Aria) - becoming apartments
  1st & 1st (across from Aria) - potentially becoming West Elm hotel
  The massive surface lot behind Bachelor Farmer by train tracks - HCRRA selling the property in 2017

Sure you've got the ramp by the new Maverick hotels, but that's contract parking for business around the area including Shorentsein's Washington Ave properties, plus it'll be used for residential parking for Maverick & townhome residents so I'd say it's unlikely they convert to hourly parking.

That leaves you with the lot of Washington Ave & 2nd Ave, which probably won't last very long and the small lots by the Monte Carlo.