Downtown Minneapolis Restaurant News

Downtown - North Loop - Mill District - Elliot Park - Loring Park
mnmike
Wells Fargo Center
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby mnmike » October 23rd, 2013, 8:27 am

It seems like some people responding here aren't realizing that the places in Gaviidae are closing because they are being evicted for renovation...Instead they are wondering why these places have "failed". Well, eviction is why. Same was the case with the fast food places in City Center (including McDonalds) when that food court was closed. Sure a couple others have closed in other areas of downtown, but that is pretty normal up and down. Many will open again at some point if a franchisee finds a suitable place...I imagine a lot of them want to be in a food court setting, which isn't common anymore downtown.

Anyway, it is good that they are converting some more retail space and forcing it down to the first two floors. I just hope they make the first two floors look good, and not too cave like if they are closing up the atrium.

Tom H.
US Bank Plaza
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby Tom H. » October 23rd, 2013, 9:04 am

Yes, I agree. They've 'failed' in that there is a higher and better use for the space than what McDonalds could provide. Nobody said that the surface parking lot at 5th & Nicollet 'failed' when it got replaced by the Nic on Fifth.

jet777
Nicollet Mall
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby jet777 » October 23rd, 2013, 9:18 am

i think your description of a "high concentration" of begging and loitering is not accurate.
Really? When is the last time you walked down Nicollet? "Too many" loiterers might be subjective, but "higher concentration" than other areas of downtown I can't waste my time arguing.

bubzki2
Foshay Tower
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby bubzki2 » October 23rd, 2013, 9:41 am

I couldn't find anything on this board relating to the closing of King and I Thai - http://www.kingandithai.com - their website says they're looking for a new location, but http://www.bringmethenews.com/2012/11/1 ... -32-years/ various articles indicate the management is retiring.

I'm surprised the signs are still up and no one else has moved in or anything. Anyone know what the status is at present?

Aville_37
Union Depot
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby Aville_37 » October 23rd, 2013, 9:53 am

I think people's tastes for food are definitely changing as well. There will always be those craving a fast hamburger from McDonald's, etc. but would love to see more of the truck food businesses morph into mortar dining spots. Also - would be great if finally some of the out state national franchises may finally move in - Protein Bar, Argo Tea, Forever Yogurt, Native Foods, Pret A Manger.

Aville_37
Union Depot
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby Aville_37 » October 23rd, 2013, 9:57 am

It seems like some people responding here aren't realizing that the places in Gaviidae are closing because they are being evicted for renovation...Instead they are wondering why these places have "failed". Well, eviction is why. Same was the case with the fast food places in City Center (including McDonalds) when that food court was closed. Sure a couple others have closed in other areas of downtown, but that is pretty normal up and down. Many will open again at some point if a franchisee finds a suitable place...I imagine a lot of them want to be in a food court setting, which isn't common anymore downtown.

Anyway, it is good that they are converting some more retail space and forcing it down to the first two floors. I just hope they make the first two floors look good, and not too cave like if they are closing up the atrium.
In a way is a shame. Gaviidae I & II are/were two of the most beautiful shopping malls in the Twin City. Gaviidae I was designed by world-renown architect so hopefully changes will be mostly be minor cosmetic updates. I sincerely hope that renovations to Gaviidae I will not close the atrium and leave the Loon fountain, etc. in place.

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woofner
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby woofner » October 23rd, 2013, 10:55 am

I couldn't find anything on this board relating to the closing of King and I Thai...
I'm surprised the signs are still up and no one else has moved in or anything. Anyone know what the status is at present?
I'm also surprised, though not displeased, that the sign is still up. I heard from a reliable source that the restaurant space would be converted into apartments (boo). According to my source, Westminster was going to pay for the conversion to a handful of units to make up for the dozens lost when they razed the Merrimark for their parking lot. I can't find any indication that ever happened, all that's on the City's website is the National Register nomination earlier this year. Maybe they're still waiting for the register or the resulting grants?
"Who rescued whom!"

Didier
Capella Tower
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby Didier » October 23rd, 2013, 11:55 am

It seems like some people responding here aren't realizing that the places in Gaviidae are closing because they are being evicted for renovation.
I would be surprised if downtown Minneapolis is without a McDonalds for long. McDonalds is comparably cheaper and faster than food trucks, so they're not exactly the same market.

Also, for what it's worth, there's a McDonalds on the Champs-Élysées, and in just about every other major first-world city in the world, so not having a McDonalds isn't necessarily a sign of Minneapolis exeptionalism.

Wedgeguy
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby Wedgeguy » October 23rd, 2013, 7:31 pm

It seems like some people responding here aren't realizing that the places in Gaviidae are closing because they are being evicted for renovation...Instead they are wondering why these places have "failed". Well, eviction is why. Same was the case with the fast food places in City Center (including McDonalds) when that food court was closed. Sure a couple others have closed in other areas of downtown, but that is pretty normal up and down. Many will open again at some point if a franchisee finds a suitable place...I imagine a lot of them want to be in a food court setting, which isn't common anymore downtown.

Anyway, it is good that they are converting some more retail space and forcing it down to the first two floors. I just hope they make the first two floors look good, and not too cave like if they are closing up the atrium.
In a way is a shame. Gaviidae I & II are/were two of the most beautiful shopping malls in the Twin City. Gaviidae I was designed by world-renown architect so hopefully changes will be mostly be minor cosmetic updates. I sincerely hope that renovations to Gaviidae I will not close the atrium and leave the Loon fountain, etc. in place.
I will agree with you on G1 being a stunner, G2 was a mess when it opened. G1 has the open sunlight atrium that we LOVE to walk thru, but rarely stop into the shops. While G2 was a mess to begin with in trying to lure shoppers up the escalators to the food court. It did not happen and that is part of why they did the second skyway to get people to come over to that food court. Again it failed to work. I do not think that the fair motif helped things along. Made me think of greasy food and not what I'd want for lunch. With out the skylight atrium like G1 the retail always felt dark and dreary. The fact that the RBC office building lobbies eat into the space, never gave it a full all around visual experience as you were generally looking at a blank walls on the office tower side of the atrium not store fronts. Hopefully when we contain retail to the 1st and 2nd floors in G2 we can make it much more appealing to those who want to shop or having the food court where people don't have to go out of their way to get to will increase traffic. But if they don't have food that people want to eat they will fail either way.

Seeing this is a restaurant thread I'll just say that retail in G1 will return at least to retail, at least on the first 2 maybe 3 levels, when the cities shopping population increases and we redo the City Center bunker into an inviting place that people on the outside want to walk into for shopping or a meal. With the new increasing downtown population there will hopefully be some new shopping opportunities in the next few years. Both restaurants and retail will get better when you give your customer a product that they truly want.
Last edited by Wedgeguy on October 24th, 2013, 10:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

twinkess
Target Field
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby twinkess » October 24th, 2013, 10:09 am

Nicollet is a funny place, because the street and the skyways are an interesting observation of socioeconomic divide. Gerbil tunnels have a bunch of young finance and target middle managers talking about which prekindergarten to enroll their kids in or what trim package their new Hyundai Santa Fe has. Meanwhile the streets have a disappointingly high concentration of begging and loitering. Anyway, the point related to restaurants here is that mcdonalds certainly caters to the latter despite lame efforts to move into fast healthy offerings. I could see one doing okay at street level, but not surprised to see it fail in the skyway. They can blame food trucks all they want, but they offer superior food at reasonable prices (at least reasonable enough to find a a good quantity of customers). The brick and mortar places that also follow this model do well too, as has already been pointed out.
Apparently didn't read the article. The McDonalds has a line all during lunch. The problem is they are being evicted, not closing for lack of business.

jet777
Nicollet Mall
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby jet777 » October 24th, 2013, 11:37 am

Apparently didn't read the article. The McDonalds has a line all during lunch. The problem is they are being evicted, not closing for lack of business.
Just glad to find out I'm not the only one who doesn't read every article and post, since mnmike pointed this out two days ago.

at40man
Rice Park
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby at40man » October 25th, 2013, 12:05 pm

The articles calls out the exception of Andrea Pizza, but will any other venues in the Gaviidae food court be closing Oct 31st in addition to McDonald's? There's only a handful of eateries up there at this point.

twinkess
Target Field
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby twinkess » October 28th, 2013, 8:52 am

Construction barriers have been placed around the old Jamba Juice stand skyway level in City Center between Len and Baja Sol. The barrier advertizes a place called "The Salad Bar" if I remember correctly.

at40man
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby at40man » October 28th, 2013, 9:31 am

Maybe it can return to City Center! ;)

Image

twinkess
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby twinkess » October 28th, 2013, 10:00 am

Wow that brings back memories!

twinkess
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby twinkess » October 28th, 2013, 11:54 am

The downtown McDonalds is closed already (a bit early).

5th Ave Guy
Landmark Center
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby 5th Ave Guy » October 28th, 2013, 3:16 pm

Construction barriers have been placed around the old Jamba Juice stand skyway level in City Center between Len and Baja Sol. The barrier advertizes a place called "The Salad Bar" if I remember correctly.
It's also taking over the old Jamba spot on the ground floor level... next to Starbucks.

There's also a new convenience store going in next to UPS on the Skyway level.

Minneapolisite

Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby Minneapolisite » October 28th, 2013, 6:12 pm

All you hear from people who try to revitalize downtowns is "we need more people to support the retail and amenities that make downtowns great", yet as downtown Minneapolis continues to grow at record levels retail continues to vacate the premises. What gives?
I think what's overlooked is the kind of people being targeted to move Downtown. Loring Park is a very dense neighborhood with quite a few new apartment buildings charging around double for what you could get in one of the many old brick apartments. The high density (approx. population density of 13,000 residents per sq mi has not translated into tons of retail in the neighborhood proper. Just look at how long existing spaces right on Nicollet south of Grant can sit vacant and how Harmon Place is quiet enough after 5 that you can hear a pin drop: not much going on there to contribute some street life at all despite numerous storefronts. Now for quite a few peope high-density w/o lots of hustle and bustle is seen as a good thing and most of those people don't know that the two are not mutually exclusive, but there you go.

I'm thinking that the reason why so many new dense apartment buildings around Downtown haven't resulted in a corresponding rise in retail is because the demographics being wooed into Downtown are not people who live an urban lifestyle and so they bring their old habits (and cars) with them when they move Downtown. You have a good number of people who are accustomed to suburban living: shopping in the burbs at a mall, spending a lot more time inside their home than out, spending lots of money on things to fill up their living space in lieu of spending money at local spots for just about everything: shopping, dining, going out, etc. Residents in neighborhoods like Whittier and West Bank have median household incomes that are a good deal lower than Loring Park or North Loop, but residents in general in the former are apparently more focused on living outside of their apartments. Eat Street and Cedar seem to have more activity thanks to local residents than those largely quiet apartment towers in Loring Park or the silent streets lined with several mid-rise apartments in North Loop. I'd personally like to go out more in Loring Park, but options are very limited so Whittier is basically my secondary neighborhood since I spend a good deal of time (and money there when I'm not home. I'm guessing there aren't enough people like me, someone who would spend more disposable income in Loring Park if there were more places to go, for developers and entrepreneurs to bother adding much more to the retail scene.
I couldn't find anything on this board relating to the closing of King and I Thai...
I'm surprised the signs are still up and no one else has moved in or anything. Anyone know what the status is at present?
I'm also surprised, though not displeased, that the sign is still up. I heard from a reliable source that the restaurant space would be converted into apartments (boo). According to my source, Westminster was going to pay for the conversion to a handful of units to make up for the dozens lost when they razed the Merrimark for their parking lot. I can't find any indication that ever happened, all that's on the City's website is the National Register nomination earlier this year. Maybe they're still waiting for the register or the resulting grants?
This certainly coincides with my theory if true. Anyone else have an idea why more apartments in an already dense residential neighborhood are chipping away at the very small amount of existing retail spaces?

PhilmerPhil
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby PhilmerPhil » October 28th, 2013, 7:22 pm

^I think there's a lot of truth to what you're saying. This is extremely anecdotal, but I once met someone who lives in Mill City Apartments and drives to work in the 7 corners area. Never once tried biking or walking...

Moderato
Block E
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Re: Downtown Restaurant News

Postby Moderato » October 28th, 2013, 9:30 pm

With pricing pressure from the likes of Amazon and big box stores, it's tough for bricks and mortar retail operations. Customers mostly want convenience and value, which is something hard to offer your average metro-area shopper if you're leasing expensive space in downtown Minneapolis. If you look at the downtown retailers that seem to be making a go of it, it's boutiques, convenience retailers (smoke shops, Walgreens, liquor), and now grocers. In the case of the boutiques, they offer a unique product that permits a wider margin, and they might benefit from a hip address (i.e. north loop) or a location in close proximity to their highly targeted clientele (Hubert White). In the case of convenience retailers, they require little space, few employees, and are selling the sort of thing the people (office workers, out-of-towners) need right now, even if it costs a few bucks more. As far as the grocers are concerned, they are clearly looking toward increased downtown populations and it remains to be seen how they will fare over the long term. I suppose you could add sex shops to the list of successful downtown operations, but they're sort of boutiques and are downtown mostly for zoning reasons, right?

Anyway, if you're Joe American retailer, you want ample parking, freeway accessibility, cheap rent, and a good set-up for shipping and receiving, all in short supply downtown. Add to this a higher Minneapolis sales tax, and you have a recipe for the continued exodus of average retailers. Department stores in particular do not make sense downtown anymore, especially multiple department stores. They need a lot of space and a lot of staff, and need to move an inredible amount of product to turn a profit. Maybe Macy's will finally benefit when they are the last ones standing. I think these are the same reasons Best-Buy, REI, and the like are reluctant to move downtown, unless for a flagship-type store where the idea is more about advertising/visibility. If downtown were twice or three times as big as it is now, and getting OUT of downtown to shop became difficult for a large population of residents (Manhattan, London), I think you'd see more bona fide retail moving in.


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