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Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 8th, 2018, 3:58 pm
by Qhaberl
I did not know that hotels can be built in spec. Thanks for the info. I might be mistaken, but I believe that construction trailer has been there for a while.


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Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 8th, 2018, 3:59 pm
by Qhaberl
Would be nice if the building could break ground with in the next couple weeks. I’m not sure how often groundbreakings happen in the winter. I would assume that since the ground is frozen, it makes things a little more difficult.




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Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 8th, 2018, 4:05 pm
by HiawathaGuy
Qhaberl wrote:
November 8th, 2018, 3:59 pm
Would be nice if the building could break ground with in the next couple weeks. I’m not sure how often groundbreakings happen in the winter. I would assume that since the ground is frozen, it makes things a little more difficult.
These type of projects can break ground pretty late into the year. Nic on 5th broke ground in December, since it's excavation work and the top few feet aren't frozen solid yet. But my guess is they could break ground on this whenever - since they'll be digging down for a while first.

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 8th, 2018, 4:47 pm
by Silophant
Even when the ground's frozen, it's not impossible to do excavation. It's just more expensive, since you have to melt the soil with heat blankets or similar. So, it's an added expense, which may or may not be more of an added expense than waiting until spring, once you've balanced it against crew availability and equipment costs and whatever other financing factors go into it.

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 8th, 2018, 11:04 pm
by aeisenberg
Qhaberl wrote:
November 8th, 2018, 3:59 pm
Would be nice if the building could break ground with in the next couple weeks. I’m not sure how often groundbreakings happen in the winter. I would assume that since the ground is frozen, it makes things a little more difficult.
Wedgeguy LIVES!!!

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 12th, 2018, 10:53 am
by MNdible
So, it seems like the controversial bit of this proposal is the porte cochere. I understand why the city has concerns about it, but it seems like the alternatives are worse, not better. Is this really worth picking a fight over?

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 12th, 2018, 12:09 pm
by Qhaberl
This may be a repetitive question, so if it is I apologize. I was riding the bus pass this site today, and I noticed that buses are still using the parking lot as the turnaround area. Where will the turnaround area be once the development begins construction?


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Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 13th, 2018, 10:00 am
by dajazz
Qhaberl wrote:
November 8th, 2018, 3:58 pm
I did not know that hotels can be built in spec. Thanks for the info. I might be mistaken, but I believe that construction trailer has been there for a while.


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The trailer is nothing new, it's been there months

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 13th, 2018, 11:00 am
by nordeast homer
dajazz wrote:
November 13th, 2018, 10:00 am
The trailer is nothing new, it's been there months
There has been a construction trailer on this site off and on for a couple of years.

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 14th, 2018, 10:01 am
by alexschief
I want to commend the Planning Commission for their thoughtful and honest discussion about this deeply compromised project last night. It's not fair to the commission or to the city that this project has been allowed to come to this stage, where it needs to move quickly through regulatory approvals in order to get going, yet retains such significant flaws.

In reverse order of how much these flaws bug me:

4. The lit RBC sign on top of the building: This isn't the end of the world, especially because it will be facing in towards the city, and not out towards the river or any of the popular skyline photo angles which itself is not a major issue. But this is an annoying thing to be taken hostage on. Is this really a must for RBC? They're gonna pull out of the project because they don't get to have a 12x9 sign on the building? Silly.

3. The porte-cochère: The city has been trying to hold the line, unsuccessfully, against this. Adding two curb cuts to Hennepin is unfortunate, but probably preferable to curbside pick up and drop off. As a pedestrian, bicyclist, or any other user of the street, I think I'd prefer that vehicles loading or unloading at the hotel move out of the right-of-way to conduct their business. Several design moves, like making sure the sidewalk and bike infrastructure are raised and that cars have to ramp up and down to cross them, and really aggressive warning signage, might make cars moving in and out of the porte-cochère less dangerous.

2. The horrible block and a half long skyway: Something else that the developers have portrayed as a "must," as if it somehow isn't possible to just walk on the ground level across Nicollet Mall and along Cancer Survivor's Park. The city has spent tens of millions to redo a street that developers are now desperately trying to build walkways that will avoid it. It's embarrassing and ugly that Nicollet Mall will end with this monstrosity.

1. The driveway at Washington and Hennepin: I'm glad that of all of these flaws, the Planning Commission chose to hold the line on this one. The corner of Washington and Hennepin should ideally be retail. If not that, then it should at least be something useful and welcoming. A driveway screened by landscaping is totally unacceptable.

A bunch of these problems stem from the city's absurd streetcar easement. That should've been eliminated to allow United Properties to do a better job on this project. There could've been multiple buildings on this land. Instead, Nicollet Mall will end in what might be a sorry plaza and a skyway, and aBRT on Central and Nicollet continues to be postponed because this silly streetcar idea stands in the way.

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 14th, 2018, 10:16 am
by Silophant
I wasn't able to watch the meeting last night. What's up with the skyway? Why does the skyway to the Library that's literally always been the plan suddenly not work?

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 14th, 2018, 10:35 am
by sushisimo
Exactly. I can't imagine it's more cost effective. I don't know if something arose with the Library cooperation? Wasn't an issue before. And like alexschief said, it's hideous and will make the Marquette Plaza building look like a giant flatscreen TV with an ugly power cord hanging across Nicollet.

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 14th, 2018, 10:41 am
by MNdible
Didn't see it either, but I understand that as things currently stand, a skyway to the library only connects you to the library and nowhere else. Unless the second half of the Opus block gets developed concurrently with the Gateway. I'd assume the library path is still their preferred routing.

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 14th, 2018, 11:32 am
by MN Fats
Four Seasons confirmed per Finance & Commerce.

https://finance-commerce.com/2018/11/fo ... way-tower/

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 14th, 2018, 12:26 pm
by mattaudio
United Properties said the skyway to Marquette Plaza was a sticking point because the Library will not be connected to the larger skyway network until Phase II of the Opus/Ritz Block project. In which case I say... ok then, pay a few mil for a temporary skyway between the library and Phase I, or get an easement from Xcel to put a skyway along the alley behind their building connecting towards Renaissance Square or Lumber Exchange. A skyway to Marquette Plaza is not good.

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 14th, 2018, 12:37 pm
by alexschief
Or just have people walk outside for a couple years.

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 14th, 2018, 1:31 pm
by amiller92
What's under Cancer Survivors Park? Parking, right? Any chance of a tunnel?

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 14th, 2018, 1:55 pm
by dajazz
amiller92 wrote:
November 14th, 2018, 1:31 pm
What's under Cancer Survivors Park? Parking, right? Any chance of a tunnel?
The old Federal Reserve vault and a lot of its operations were underground in that area. Below that is parking. A tunnel wouldn't be feasible.

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 14th, 2018, 2:11 pm
by Multimodal
alexschief wrote:Or just have people walk outside for a couple years.
This is the only logical response.

Re: Gateway Tower (RBC/Four Seasons) - 37 stories - 503'

Posted: November 14th, 2018, 2:51 pm
by Silophant
Sounds like no one from the Four Seasons has spent enough time using the skyway system to realize what a crappy connection that is. It's a looong way out of the way to go to get to anything besides parking ramps.