Washington Avenue (reconstruction, restriping, etc.)

Downtown - North Loop - Mill District - Elliot Park - Loring Park
User avatar
Nick
Capella Tower
Posts: 3004
Joined: May 30th, 2012, 9:33 pm
Location: Loring Park, Minneapolis

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby Nick » October 5th, 2014, 5:53 pm

Image

seanrichardryan
Capella Tower
Posts: 3935
Joined: June 3rd, 2012, 9:33 pm
Location: Merriam Park, St. Paul
Contact:

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby seanrichardryan » January 30th, 2015, 11:57 pm

http://www.startribune.com/local/minnea ... 02101.html
Washington Avenue project paves the way for future roads
Image
Q. What, what? A. In da butt.

User avatar
woofner
Wells Fargo Center
Posts: 1327
Joined: June 1st, 2012, 10:04 am

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby woofner » January 31st, 2015, 4:16 pm

Hopefully Washington north of Hennepin be restriped with bike lanes in 2015 that the new cycletrack is somewhat useful for somebody.
"Who rescued whom!"

Chava
Nicollet Mall
Posts: 186
Joined: March 29th, 2014, 7:24 pm
Location: NE MPLS

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby Chava » January 31st, 2015, 6:05 pm

I guess the article didn't mention it. They plan on re striping to Plymouth. Wash Ave will go down to one lane each side, bike lane, center turn lane.

They presented the plan at North Loop comm assoc meeting.

User avatar
Nick
Capella Tower
Posts: 3004
Joined: May 30th, 2012, 9:33 pm
Location: Loring Park, Minneapolis

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby Nick » January 31st, 2015, 8:29 pm

Strib wrote:The county wants to create these bike and pedestrian features all the way to Interstate 35W on Washington, an idea supported by leaders of the downtown greening conservancy. That’s at least five years off, however. It plans to do interim bike lane striping until then. West of Hennepin, it plans a combination of new bike lanes and protected bikes lanes to Plymouth.

Silophant
Moderator
Posts: 3821
Joined: June 20th, 2012, 4:33 pm
Location: The Gateway

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby Silophant » January 31st, 2015, 8:38 pm

Hopefully the interim bike lane striping extends across the 35W bridge. They're not nearly as useful if they dump bikers back into the vehicle lanes while it's still a car sewer.

User avatar
woofner
Wells Fargo Center
Posts: 1327
Joined: June 1st, 2012, 10:04 am

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby woofner » February 2nd, 2015, 10:33 am

Thanks. Sorry, the internet has trained me to not read the last few paragraphs of any article.

Interesting that they're doing a 4-to-3 on Washington in the North Loop, since it's at the upper limits of what even progressive jurisdictions consider acceptable traffic levels for that treatment (about 20k per day). I thought Hennepin County had refused 4-to-3s on streets over 16k or 17k.

I thought I remembered there being bike lanes on the 35w overpass and continuing about halfway down the block towards Cedar.
"Who rescued whom!"

Silophant
Moderator
Posts: 3821
Joined: June 20th, 2012, 4:33 pm
Location: The Gateway

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby Silophant » February 2nd, 2015, 10:43 am

Hope so. IMO(o), once you get east of the northbound ramps, the traffic is down enough to make bike lanes not such a necessity. And, of course, many bikers would be turning left onto Washington or 15th or 2nd or whatever that chunk of street in front of Republic is called, and wouldn't be in the bike lane anyway.

twincitizen
Moderator
Posts: 6203
Joined: May 31st, 2012, 7:27 pm
Location: Standish-Ericsson

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby twincitizen » February 4th, 2015, 10:30 am


MNdible
is great.
Posts: 5813
Joined: June 8th, 2012, 8:14 pm
Location: Minneapolis

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby MNdible » February 4th, 2015, 10:44 am

The traffic numbers I've seen still show 19,000 cars/day through the North Loop west of the trench, and 21,000 east of the trench. That doesn't jive with my anecdotal experience, which has traffic dropping off significantly west of the trench.

It seems like the plan they're showing in the PDF is prety good fit for the realities I see on the ground.

The city is going to have to come up with some significant new funds to maintain all of these protected bike lanes they want to build. It's going to be much more involved and expensive than the old bike lanes they're replacing.

mattaudio
Stone Arch Bridge
Posts: 7936
Joined: June 19th, 2012, 2:04 pm
Location: NORI: NOrth of RIchfield

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby mattaudio » February 4th, 2015, 10:51 am

Anyone know how to make a striping plan such as that? PM me. There may be money in it for you.

helsinki
Landmark Center
Posts: 298
Joined: October 9th, 2012, 2:01 am

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby helsinki » April 8th, 2015, 7:22 pm

MNdible wrote: The city is going to have to come up with some significant new funds to maintain all of these protected bike lanes they want to build. It's going to be much more involved and expensive than the old bike lanes they're replacing.
How much more expensive is it to maintain a protected bike lane compared to a non-protected lane?

PhilmerPhil
Moderator
Posts: 1207
Joined: May 31st, 2012, 11:38 am
Location: SOUP: SOuth UPtown

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby PhilmerPhil » April 8th, 2015, 7:27 pm

Unfortunate news: https://twitter.com/mplsbike/status/583661201743294464

The reconstruction has been pushed out another year.

twincitizen
Moderator
Posts: 6203
Joined: May 31st, 2012, 7:27 pm
Location: Standish-Ericsson

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby twincitizen » April 9th, 2015, 6:32 am

I was starting to suspect as much when it was left off all of the recent press releases touting Hennepin County's 2015 construction projects.

Restriping from Hennepin to Plymouth in North Loop, including bike lanes (and major road diet from 5th Ave N to Plymouth) is apparently still on though. I suspect this will happen in late summer or early fall, since they have only just begun public hearings and whatnot.

helsinki
Landmark Center
Posts: 298
Joined: October 9th, 2012, 2:01 am

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby helsinki » July 28th, 2015, 3:05 pm

With the reconstruction postponed, perhaps the designers can reconsider one point:

It seems as though the corner radii have mostly been enlarged. Is this correct? If so, it's not a good idea.

The National Association of City Transport Officials (NACTO) wisely points out that larger urban curb radii create dangerous intersections with unsafe turning speeds (See: http://nacto.org/publication/urban-stre ... ner-radii/).

Yet, unless I'm blind, they've been enlarged. Look at the corner of 3rd & Washington for instance (See: http://www.hennepin.us/~/media/hennepin ... ouncil.pdf). They're huge! Seems like a major step back.

And while they're at it, perhaps they can shorten the block-long "right turn" lanes, include bus-bulbs, and give a wee bit more thought to the protected bike lane intersection crossings...

mattaudio
Stone Arch Bridge
Posts: 7936
Joined: June 19th, 2012, 2:04 pm
Location: NORI: NOrth of RIchfield

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby mattaudio » July 28th, 2015, 3:10 pm

^this. I'm very concerned about this redo... We need to tighten up corners, not do the opposite.

I'm also concerned about the bus pull-outs. This is still going to have multiple lanes in each direction: We should be building bus bulbs, not bus caves. https://streets.mn/2015/05/18/the-import ... bus-stops/

MNdible
is great.
Posts: 5813
Joined: June 8th, 2012, 8:14 pm
Location: Minneapolis

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby MNdible » July 28th, 2015, 4:01 pm

I think that's partially driven by the way the protected bike lanes are handled at the corners, right? The actual raised curb radius for the pedestrian crosswalks are pretty tight.

helsinki
Landmark Center
Posts: 298
Joined: October 9th, 2012, 2:01 am

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby helsinki » July 28th, 2015, 4:05 pm

MNdible wrote:I think that's partially driven by the way the protected bike lanes are handled at the corners, right? The actual raised curb radius for the pedestrian crosswalks are pretty tight.
I don't think so. The bike lanes are also going to be raised (level with the sidewalk), aren't they?

MNdible
is great.
Posts: 5813
Joined: June 8th, 2012, 8:14 pm
Location: Minneapolis

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby MNdible » July 28th, 2015, 4:18 pm

My read is that they are raised until they get to the intersections, and then they must drop down to street level (based on where the ADA pedestrian ramps are located). In the PDF, I think the dark black lines represent a full raised curb.

helsinki
Landmark Center
Posts: 298
Joined: October 9th, 2012, 2:01 am

Re: Washington Avenue

Postby helsinki » July 28th, 2015, 4:42 pm

If the black lines are the raised curb, then there are still quite a few that arc very broadly.

Regardless, it seems like the designation of the space for cyclists will likely be ignored by motorists under this scenario. A good video posted in the comments of a streets.mn article highlights the point (final comment: https://streets.mn/2013/05/29/all-the-be ... eet-level/). It begins: "The most important feature of this design is this protective traffic island." Without a clear physical demarcation of space, it seems highly likely that the broader radius (in grey) will become the default traffic turning radius. Here is the video explaining the theory: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FlApbxL ... e=youtu.be

It is unclear how Hennepin County intends to for the cycle track to meet the intersection, cross it, and relate to the pedestrian realm. As the above video very simply illustrates, an effective design for this exact situation already exists. There is no need for Hennepin County to reinvent the wheel here.


Return to “Minneapolis - Downtown”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests