Revel / Target Store- 1300 West Lake St

Calhoun-Isles, Cedar-Riverside, Longfellow, Nokomis, Phillips, Powderhorn, and Southwest
RailBaronYarr
Capella Tower
Posts: 2625
Joined: September 16th, 2012, 4:31 pm

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby RailBaronYarr » June 11th, 2015, 10:02 am

Jesus H. Christ.

"Several at the sparsely attended meeting objected to the way the towers would dwarf pedestrians, arguing that it would create an unpleasant sidewalk environment."
"Oberpriller said he would take the critique into consideration." I'm sure.

User avatar
FISHMANPET
IDS Center
Posts: 4241
Joined: June 6th, 2012, 2:19 pm
Location: Corcoran

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby FISHMANPET » June 11th, 2015, 10:05 am

"I consider that critique to be incredibly stupid"

Archiapolis
US Bank Plaza
Posts: 768
Joined: November 2nd, 2012, 8:59 am

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby Archiapolis » June 11th, 2015, 10:24 am

Hey there's only so many texture packs in the Revit library or something something.
Sketchup but close...

UrsusUrbanicus
Nicollet Mall
Posts: 127
Joined: February 13th, 2014, 2:08 pm

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby UrsusUrbanicus » June 11th, 2015, 12:53 pm

Jesus H. Christ.

"Several at the sparsely attended meeting objected to the way the towers would dwarf pedestrians, arguing that it would create an unpleasant sidewalk environment."
In a metro with over 200 independent suburbs at varying levels of density, how and why do people with this sort of mindset choose to live in Uptown in the first place? Same goes for the complaints associated with proposed apartment developments: OMG, there might be social gatherings, and visits from the dreaded People We Don't Know. Here it is, 2015, in the sixteenth-largest metro in the country, and apparently we're supposed to vet our Grindr or Tinder meetups with Kim Jong-Lundegaard?!?

aeisenberg
Landmark Center
Posts: 269
Joined: June 12th, 2012, 7:45 pm

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby aeisenberg » June 11th, 2015, 4:35 pm

if you're going to claim bad design this is where you add warrant to your claim, because from a modernist point of of view this is a really great building.
You're right, I should explain. FWIW, don't hate it enough to warrant a big fight. While I'm all for modernity, I just think there are way too many materials /things trying to get your attention in the design. It's trying too hard to be interesting for my taste. I think more understated designs with fewer (but quality) materials age better. Also, it looks like there are looooooong walls of glass without entrances at street level on this development.

That said, The Walkway is a pretty over-the-top design, and the next Mozaic phase will be pretty out there as well. There could be something to grouping a bunch of bold looking buildings together here.
Aaron Eisenberg / Realtor, Keller Williams Integrity
612.568.5828 / [email protected] / 1350 Lagoon Ave #900
http://www.agentaaron.com

Wedgeguy
Capella Tower
Posts: 3404
Joined: June 1st, 2012, 6:59 am

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby Wedgeguy » June 11th, 2015, 4:53 pm

I'm not sure what you mean by too many materials. There is white and charcoal cladding with splashes of yellow as accents inside of the rectangles that give the building some visual texture. Compare this to the flat one dimensional faux apartment across the street with it's multiple claddings, I think there is a distinct night and day as to which I would choose to want to live in. I'm glad to see windows along Lake, Fremont, and Lagoon at street level. It will be up to the retailers as to whether we get to see into the store or are faced with looking at frosted glass , back side of shelving units, or drywall from so called display windows. This is a building that stands out nicely with out being too over the top like the Walkway.

John
Capella Tower
Posts: 2102
Joined: May 31st, 2012, 2:06 pm

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby John » June 11th, 2015, 7:35 pm

Uptown has a long standing tradition of being a hip and trendy area of Minneapolis, with a good amount of pedestrian oriented retail . The architects acknowledge that in the design which reinforces those characteristics of the neighborhood. That's a very good thing. Can't wait to see this built!

aeisenberg
Landmark Center
Posts: 269
Joined: June 12th, 2012, 7:45 pm

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby aeisenberg » June 11th, 2015, 8:50 pm

I'm not sure what you mean by too many materials.
Look at everything they're throwing up there: Black stone, wood?, white cement panels, gray/black stripe cladding (?), yellow paint (Uh huh!/ You know what it is!/ Black and yellow/ black and yellow/ black and yellow/ black and yellow!), big rectangle opening for balconies, square openings for balconies, rectangles to mark the main entrance, big vertically oriented windows next to big horizontally oriented ones, and purple paint for some reason.

This is not good design. This is a cluster. Sorry.
Aaron Eisenberg / Realtor, Keller Williams Integrity
612.568.5828 / [email protected] / 1350 Lagoon Ave #900
http://www.agentaaron.com

User avatar
Nathan
Capella Tower
Posts: 3695
Joined: June 1st, 2012, 10:42 am

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby Nathan » June 12th, 2015, 4:52 am

I'm not sure what you mean by too many materials.
Look at everything they're throwing up there: Black stone, wood?, white cement panels, gray/black stripe cladding (?), yellow paint (Uh huh!/ You know what it is!/ Black and yellow/ black and yellow/ black and yellow/ black and yellow!), big rectangle opening for balconies, square openings for balconies, rectangles to mark the main entrance, big vertically oriented windows next to big horizontally oriented ones, and purple paint for some reason.

This is not good design. This is a cluster. Sorry.
We get it, it's not your style. But the things you point out are what makes it cool to a modernist. At least if you're going to try to criticize design, know your terminology and understand the differences between your personal taste and what the movement behind it is. I don't like when buildings try to look bland or historic but at least I can talk about whether they're a good building within their context.

What differentiates this from the actual cluster that is the walkway is that it has a consistent theme around the entire building, clean lines and simple shapes. Squares and rectangles are not so different, they have the same aesthetic, where as the walkway has multiple geometric shapes and angles all with their own material. Here the Yellow and grey ate always used in the same contexts, in the protrusions and bump outs. And the white is used consistently as a back drop. It's not a perfect modernist building but it's certainly not the mess you're making it out to be.

min-chi-cbus
Capella Tower
Posts: 2869
Joined: June 1st, 2012, 9:19 am

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby min-chi-cbus » June 12th, 2015, 7:36 am

I'm not sure what you mean by too many materials.
Look at everything they're throwing up there: Black stone, wood?, white cement panels, gray/black stripe cladding (?), yellow paint (Uh huh!/ You know what it is!/ Black and yellow/ black and yellow/ black and yellow/ black and yellow!), big rectangle opening for balconies, square openings for balconies, rectangles to mark the main entrance, big vertically oriented windows next to big horizontally oriented ones, and purple paint for some reason.

This is not good design. This is a cluster. Sorry.
We get it, it's not your style. But the things you point out are what makes it cool to a modernist. At least if you're going to try to criticize design, know your terminology and understand the differences between your personal taste and what the movement behind it is. I don't like when buildings try to look bland or historic but at least I can talk about whether they're a good building within their context.

What differentiates this from the actual cluster that is the walkway is that it has a consistent theme around the entire building, clean lines and simple shapes. Squares and rectangles are not so different, they have the same aesthetic, where as the walkway has multiple geometric shapes and angles all with their own material. Here the Yellow and grey ate always used in the same contexts, in the protrusions and bump outs. And the white is used consistently as a back drop. It's not a perfect modernist building but it's certainly not the mess you're making it out to be.
Not everyone does what you do for a living and can't speak the language. I thought his points were valid and make sense, and I agree (as a Simpleton). I don't think it necessarily comes down to not liking the modernist era either, as at least I personally like things like the Brunsfield and I believe that's a pretty modern design.

Maybe I missed something, but I'm curious what you (or others) LIKE so much about the building.....from a modernist perspective, of course. :geek:

User avatar
TommyT
Target Field
Posts: 511
Joined: August 13th, 2013, 9:21 am

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby TommyT » June 12th, 2015, 7:58 am

Here's what I would really like to know. The buildings that I see going up in Chicago all seem to be brick and fit in really well with the historical charm of the neighborhood. Why is it that developers here can only find it in themselves to use cheap cement board? Before I left lime I was laying at the pool and noticed that almost all of the gray panels already seemed warped after being open for less than two year. Maybe it's all perception, but it seems like EVERYTHING is done cheaply here. Maybe it just goes to show that Minneapolis does settle for mediocrity.

aeisenberg
Landmark Center
Posts: 269
Joined: June 12th, 2012, 7:45 pm

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby aeisenberg » June 12th, 2015, 8:42 am

Here's what I would really like to know. The buildings that I see going up in Chicago all seem to be brick and fit in really well with the historical charm of the neighborhood. Why is it that developers here can only find it in themselves to use cheap cement board? Before I left lime I was laying at the pool and noticed that almost all of the gray panels already seemed warped after being open for less than two year. Maybe it's all perception, but it seems like EVERYTHING is done cheaply here. Maybe it just goes to show that Minneapolis does settle for mediocrity.
That's my worry, too. Lots of different types of exterior materials to make up for lack of quality (see: 1800 Lake, Track 29, Walkway, Marshall). Call them boring, but I think history will be kinder to Brunsfield, Venue in Dinkytown, Edgewater, Greenleaf on Lyndale, Nicollet Square at 37th St. I also really like Zenith and the new Encore-- both modern, interesting designs without cheap clutter.

The basic design here is delightful and bold. It just feels like the guy at the party wearing 3 too many accessories. If those get ironed out, I'm all in support.
Aaron Eisenberg / Realtor, Keller Williams Integrity
612.568.5828 / [email protected] / 1350 Lagoon Ave #900
http://www.agentaaron.com

lordmoke
Wells Fargo Center
Posts: 1331
Joined: June 8th, 2012, 1:39 pm
Location: George Floyd Square

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby lordmoke » June 12th, 2015, 10:32 am


Archiapolis
US Bank Plaza
Posts: 768
Joined: November 2nd, 2012, 8:59 am

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby Archiapolis » June 12th, 2015, 11:00 am

Here's what I would really like to know. The buildings that I see going up in Chicago all seem to be brick and fit in really well with the historical charm of the neighborhood. Why is it that developers here can only find it in themselves to use cheap cement board? Before I left lime I was laying at the pool and noticed that almost all of the gray panels already seemed warped after being open for less than two year. Maybe it's all perception, but it seems like EVERYTHING is done cheaply here. Maybe it just goes to show that Minneapolis does settle for mediocrity.
I don't know about the "everything in Chicago is brick" statement but as to the rest...good criticisms.

Wedgeguy
Capella Tower
Posts: 3404
Joined: June 1st, 2012, 6:59 am

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby Wedgeguy » June 12th, 2015, 11:39 am

We will agree to disagree then. As I see really no more different materials than is the current apartment trend. Looking at Elan, Track 29, and Blu I can see less differences in material that most of them. Is it because there is no brick, is that why this does not work for you? I myself think that the protruding boxes with the contrast color help give the texture and rhythm that buildings like 800 3rd up in NL are missing. We could hope that they would use a better material than cement board for this building, But until the owners have to replace it sooner than later. After they find out the cost of going cheap is in the long run more expensive, I'm afraid it will be used too much. As I've said before, I'll take this design over the building across Fremont from it.

aeisenberg
Landmark Center
Posts: 269
Joined: June 12th, 2012, 7:45 pm

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby aeisenberg » June 12th, 2015, 1:47 pm

Wedgeguy..... that's exactly my point. This is more of a dumb trend. The difference is that this already has a plenty interesting design. There's no need to add all the stupid exterior materials. It just looks tacky. But developers can't help themselves. It drives me nuts.
Aaron Eisenberg / Realtor, Keller Williams Integrity
612.568.5828 / [email protected] / 1350 Lagoon Ave #900
http://www.agentaaron.com

Wedgeguy
Capella Tower
Posts: 3404
Joined: June 1st, 2012, 6:59 am

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby Wedgeguy » June 12th, 2015, 2:09 pm

LOL, Short of minimalism, just about ever architectural style has had an over the top style to it. Deco, Victorian, Nuevo, Can we say post modern, Italianate, all have been far from simple. Many of those are now considered masterpieces, where I'm sure some thought those styles were gaudy and unattractive. The Metropolitan building, the decorative exterior of the Plymouth building were lost because someone thought they were ugly or not clean lined enough for them. So really I will continue to differ in opinions with you on this building. To each his own. As one who walks thru the area many times a week, I'll be enjoying its presence.

David Greene
IDS Center
Posts: 4617
Joined: December 4th, 2012, 11:41 am

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby David Greene » June 12th, 2015, 2:47 pm

Many of those are now considered masterpieces, where I'm sure some thought those styles were gaudy and unattractive.
Hell, the Transitional housing style came about because people thought Queen Annes were too ostentatious. Arts & Crafts was a reaction to the manufactured nature of Victorian housing, though ironically almost all the Arts & Crafts stuff in the U.S. was machined. Be very suspicious of anyone in this region who says their house has hand-carved woodwork.

User avatar
FISHMANPET
IDS Center
Posts: 4241
Joined: June 6th, 2012, 2:19 pm
Location: Corcoran

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby FISHMANPET » June 12th, 2015, 3:01 pm

Most every architectural style is a reaction to the (perceived) negative traits of the previous style. We have no earthly idea if a style is going to be successful for 75-100 years.

seanrichardryan
IDS Center
Posts: 4092
Joined: June 3rd, 2012, 9:33 pm
Location: Merriam Park, St. Paul

Re: CPM Cheapo Site proposal - 1300 West Lake St

Postby seanrichardryan » June 12th, 2015, 3:15 pm

Don't worry folks. They'll be re-siding the sucker in 5 years because of water infiltration. Seems to be the trend anyhow.
Q. What, what? A. In da butt.


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 23 guests