Rice Creek Commons (TCAAP site) - Arden Hills

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Le Sueur
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Rice Creek Commons (TCAAP site) - Arden Hills

Postby Le Sueur » May 25th, 2013, 6:33 pm

Ramsey County has started demolition in hopes of bringing new development plans after Ryan Co. abandoned plans in 2009 and the Vikings Stadum Plans were moved to Mlps:
http://www.startribune.com/local/stpaul/208954901.html
Strib wrote:Demolition has begun at the Twin Cities Army Ammunition Plant in Arden Hills, the massive suburban parcel that the Minnesota Vikings once seriously considered for a new stadium...
Here is the news of the purchase back in Nov:
Strib wrote:...The County Board approved a $28.5 million deal Tuesday to buy the 430-acre Twin Cities Army Ammunition Plant (TCAAP) site from the federal government and finish cleaning the last 30 acres of solvent-heavy soil -- a task that will account for $22.6 million of the county's cost...
http://www.startribune.com/local/east/1 ... ml?refer=y

min-chi-cbus
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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant (Arden Hills)

Postby min-chi-cbus » May 27th, 2013, 6:13 am

Could this be the Twin Cities' version of Stapleton (Denver airport redevelopment)? I wonder what will go in here now that the stadium is not going to happen??

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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant (Arden Hills)

Postby eluko » May 30th, 2013, 5:18 pm

I'd like to see the Humphrey Terminal be rebuilt on the army lands. It'd be great for the north metro economy versus saturating the southern one. Maybe have a "bristol" sized motor speedway stadium built in its place across from the MOA and rid the area of its height restrictions.

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Le Sueur
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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant (Arden Hills)

Postby Le Sueur » May 30th, 2013, 7:14 pm

^^^Then you have to ask yourself... What's louder an airport or a motor speedway? :)
With the large and easily expandable Anoka County-Blaine Airport just 6 miles up the road, I don't really see them building a new airport here.
The raceway might actually fit in with the northern burbs, good idea.

Anyone know anything about what was pitched for this area in 2009?

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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant (Arden Hills)

Postby eluko » May 30th, 2013, 7:48 pm

That's why it would be such a perfect fit. The surrounding area is already used to the noise, and only having a few races a year doesn't even compare to the jet engines heard every 2 minutes as far south as Apple Valley.

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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant (Arden Hills)

Postby 612transplant » May 30th, 2013, 9:15 pm

Did a little google searching:

http://www.twincities.com/localnews/ci_ ... attracting

"Cleanup costs and the national economic slump prompted a local developer, the Ryan Cos., to walk away from a proposed $850 million mixed-use development in 2009. The plan was to build 1,750 units of housing units next to offices and shops."

Not very thorough, but there you go.

At 2.3 persons per household, that would be 4025 new residents in little ol' Arden Hills. Is growth of that scale in presumably a very short time period (a couple of years) really good for a community that size?

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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant (Arden Hills)

Postby Suburban Outcast » May 31st, 2013, 5:31 am

612transplant, do you wonder that because that means there would be the possibility of quite a large influx of new students into the Mounds View school system?

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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant (Arden Hills)

Postby go4guy » May 31st, 2013, 6:25 am

Any race track would need to be further north away from actual suburbs. Those tracks have races usually 2 nights a week. They have to or they won't be profitable. May not be the huge crowds of the 1 NASCAR race a year, but the cars will be just as loud.

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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant (Arden Hills)

Postby 612transplant » May 31st, 2013, 6:41 am

Outcast,

Essentially, yes. The developer can obviously mitigate any other infrastructural strain on their own, but they're not going to build a new elementary school on-site...

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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant (Arden Hills)

Postby min-chi-cbus » May 31st, 2013, 7:17 am

612transplant wrote:Did a little google searching:

http://www.twincities.com/localnews/ci_ ... attracting

"Cleanup costs and the national economic slump prompted a local developer, the Ryan Cos., to walk away from a proposed $850 million mixed-use development in 2009. The plan was to build 1,750 units of housing units next to offices and shops."

Not very thorough, but there you go.

At 2.3 persons per household, that would be 4025 new residents in little ol' Arden Hills. Is growth of that scale in presumably a very short time period (a couple of years) really good for a community that size?
I don't think of it as growth for the "little community of Arden Hills", but rather, the Twin Cities suburbs. In that light, yes, I can see the growth of 4K-5K people within 5-10 years as very very managable.

Preferably, given this site's proximity to both downtowns and accessibility to the freeways, population densities with this construction SHOULD be exceeding 5,000 ppsm, and more like 8,000-10,000 ppsm, if possible. We have so few opportunities to build this close to the core, and we've already sprawled out 20+ miles in every direction from the core with low-density development that I feel that any opportunity to build more sustainable urban/semi-urban housing is a must! In fact, I think city or county legislators should mandate than any new developments in landlocked cities should portray more urban-like amenities, such as density, walkability, access to mass transit, etc.
Last edited by min-chi-cbus on May 31st, 2013, 7:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

min-chi-cbus
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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant (Arden Hills)

Postby min-chi-cbus » May 31st, 2013, 7:18 am

612transplant wrote:Outcast,

Essentially, yes. The developer can obviously mitigate any other infrastructural strain on their own, but they're not going to build a new elementary school on-site...
They (Forest City) did in Stapleton (Colorado)......they built several, in fact!

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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant (Arden Hills)

Postby 612transplant » May 31st, 2013, 5:21 pm

I'm all for denser suburban development, and I'm all for any development at this site. I don't know about your 5-10 year forecast....I would think that after the homes are constructed, they would be looking to have them on market for no more than a year. Unless they build in phases (entirely possible), that means adding 4,000 people relatively quickly.

It would obviously be great for the city and that part of the suburbs as a whole-- an older area that has not seen large-scale development in some time. But it is not without its challenges.

I didn't know about the Colorado development, and that's cool to hear. If they do the same here, it would help a lot (plus designing a street infrastructure that provides the easiest access to 10, 35, and 694, but I assume that that's a given).

As far as other developments of this scale closer to the core, let's not forget about the Ford plant in St. Paul. Nowhere near the same scale, but eyeballing it, it is about 4X8 St. Paul city blocks. That's a huge opportunity, too, especially if built at higher than single family density, but better left to another thread...

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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant - Arden Hills

Postby Didier » June 2nd, 2013, 12:30 am

As long as we are moving the Humphrey Terminal there, why not bring the National Sports Center and have them meet in the middle?

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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant - Arden Hills

Postby twincitizen » February 5th, 2014, 10:50 pm

Didn't see this coming: Ramsey County taps St. Paul Port Authority for development

Hopefully this is just the first step towards an eventual City-County consolidation. ;)

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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant - Arden Hills

Postby talindsay » February 6th, 2014, 4:30 pm

twincitizen wrote:Didn't see this coming: Ramsey County taps St. Paul Port Authority for development

Hopefully this is just the first step towards an eventual City-County consolidation. ;)
Saint Paul can't merge with Ramsey County unless it also merges with Minneapolis and/or Minneapolis merges with its inner ring - our largest suburb can't be bigger than the proper city!

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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant - Arden Hills

Postby twincitizen » February 6th, 2014, 7:35 pm

No, you see, St. Paul merging with Ramsey County will force Minneapolis to annex a few of its suburbs to remain the largest City.


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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant - Arden Hills

Postby at40man » February 11th, 2014, 5:39 pm

talindsay wrote: Saint Paul can't merge with Ramsey County unless it also merges with Minneapolis and/or Minneapolis merges with its inner ring - our largest suburb can't be bigger than the proper city!
Technically, Minneapolis is a suburb of Saint Paul, since Saint Paul came first and Minneapolis as we know it wouldn't have ever existed without the founding of Saint Paul. Just sayin'... :)

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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant - Arden Hills

Postby FISHMANPET » February 11th, 2014, 5:46 pm

Minneapolis was founded because of the falls, the fact that it was next to St Paul is just a happy (or unhappy) accident.

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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant - Arden Hills

Postby David Greene » February 11th, 2014, 6:20 pm

FISHMANPET wrote:Minneapolis was founded because of the falls, the fact that it was next to St Paul is just a happy (or unhappy) accident.
Typically, St. Paul officials scrambled to be first and picked the wrong spot.

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Re: Twin Cities Ammunition Plant - Arden Hills

Postby talindsay » February 11th, 2014, 8:58 pm

David Greene wrote:
FISHMANPET wrote:Minneapolis was founded because of the falls, the fact that it was next to St Paul is just a happy (or unhappy) accident.
Typically, St. Paul officials scrambled to be first and picked the wrong spot.
BAM!


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