50th & France - Edina/Minneapolis

Twin Cities Suburbs
PhilmerPhil
Moderator
Posts: 1207
Joined: May 31st, 2012, 11:38 am
Location: SOUP: SOuth UPtown

50th & France - Edina/Minneapolis

Postby PhilmerPhil » February 26th, 2013, 10:06 pm


seanrichardryan
Capella Tower
Posts: 3940
Joined: June 3rd, 2012, 9:33 pm
Location: Merriam Park, St. Paul
Contact:

Re: General Suburb News

Postby seanrichardryan » February 26th, 2013, 10:32 pm

What's odd it that it is next to an existing parking ramp and across the street from another. I once worked in the area and most of the parking crunch came on weekends, especially mornings. During the week it was mostly empty.

http://goo.gl/maps/S4l7Q
Last edited by seanrichardryan on February 26th, 2013, 11:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Q. What, what? A. In da butt.

seanrichardryan
Capella Tower
Posts: 3940
Joined: June 3rd, 2012, 9:33 pm
Location: Merriam Park, St. Paul
Contact:

Re: General Suburb News

Postby seanrichardryan » February 26th, 2013, 10:38 pm

I guess the plus side is that they aren't mega-ramps, but smaller parcels. In time they could easily be sold off and redeveloped. I always thought 50th and France could benefit from a complete outer loop by continuing 49 1/2 street to Ewing Avenue into the Minneapolis side. A bit like St. Armand's Circle outside Sarasota, Florida.
Last edited by seanrichardryan on February 26th, 2013, 11:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Q. What, what? A. In da butt.

User avatar
woofner
Wells Fargo Center
Posts: 1327
Joined: June 1st, 2012, 10:04 am

Re: General Suburb News

Postby woofner » February 26th, 2013, 10:52 pm

And there is a city owned parking lot right next door, too. This doesn't make any sense at all.
"Who rescued whom!"

mattaudio
Stone Arch Bridge
Posts: 7941
Joined: June 19th, 2012, 2:04 pm
Location: NORI: NOrth of RIchfield

Re: General Suburb News

Postby mattaudio » February 27th, 2013, 8:30 am

They have until April 3 to back out of the deal. Let's help them along.

RailBaronYarr
Capella Tower
Posts: 2702
Joined: September 16th, 2012, 4:31 pm

Re: General Suburb News

Postby RailBaronYarr » February 27th, 2013, 12:25 pm

So let me get this straight.. the city is talking about buying and tearing down a building on a parcel. They will pay $2.65M for the parcel, plus demolition costs, plus likely 200-300 parking spots at $17-20k per spot for the ramp construction costs. This will cost the city upwards of $7.5M to do. Then they will maintain the ramp and patrol it to ensure people don't exceed the 2 hour maximum free parking time. And they won't charge a dime to park there. What is the benefit to the city? They're no longer collecting property taxes on the parcel (they bought it and tore it down). Can they increase the tax rate for surrounding buildings due to increased utility they'll see (more potential customers from free parking)? Perhaps. Will they EVER get back the $7.5M investment? Hell no.

This comment on the board typifies people's lack of understanding of the issue: " If Edina wants to offer free parking to people, that's their decision. If they want people to pay to park, then they'll likely kill off a lot of traffic unless merchants can offer reimbursement because of purchases."

We wonder why our cities are dirt poor and can't afford to maintain our streets and infrastructure. And I'm sure these people totally chill with municipally-owned, free parking would be totally cool if we made all public transportation free of charge, right?

MNdible
is great.
Posts: 5832
Joined: June 8th, 2012, 8:14 pm
Location: Minneapolis

Re: General Suburb News

Postby MNdible » February 27th, 2013, 1:09 pm

RailBaronYarr wrote:We wonder why our cities are dirt poor and can't afford to maintain our streets and infrastructure.
Internet historians, take note: February 27th, 2013 was the day that Edina was referred to as being "dirt poor".

RailBaronYarr
Capella Tower
Posts: 2702
Joined: September 16th, 2012, 4:31 pm

Re: General Suburb News

Postby RailBaronYarr » February 27th, 2013, 1:32 pm

MNdible wrote:
RailBaronYarr wrote:We wonder why our cities are dirt poor and can't afford to maintain our streets and infrastructure.
Internet historians, take note: February 27th, 2013 was the day that Edina was referred to as being "dirt poor".
I was referring to the general case, not specifically Edina.. That the most productive area in one of our richest cities would consider this shows the lunacy of the idea.

min-chi-cbus
Capella Tower
Posts: 3131
Joined: June 1st, 2012, 9:19 am

Re: General Suburb News

Postby min-chi-cbus » February 27th, 2013, 7:04 pm

RailBaronYarr wrote:
MNdible wrote:
RailBaronYarr wrote:We wonder why our cities are dirt poor and can't afford to maintain our streets and infrastructure.
Internet historians, take note: February 27th, 2013 was the day that Edina was referred to as being "dirt poor".
I was referring to the general case, not specifically Edina.. That the most productive area in one of our richest cities would consider this shows the lunacy of the idea.
I tend to agree with you, but Edina has to be realistic: 50th & France, for all its successes, will never be a place most of its clientelle walk to. At least, there isn't enough of a population within walking distance to support the high-end stores that exist there now. There HAS to be parking, and Edina is solving that problem.

At least it's a ramp, and not a surface lot, huh?!

RailBaronYarr
Capella Tower
Posts: 2702
Joined: September 16th, 2012, 4:31 pm

Re: General Suburb News

Postby RailBaronYarr » February 27th, 2013, 9:33 pm

min-chi-cbus wrote:I tend to agree with you, but Edina has to be realistic: 50th & France, for all its successes, will never be a place most of its clientelle walk to. At least, there isn't enough of a population within walking distance to support the high-end stores that exist there now. There HAS to be parking, and Edina is solving that problem.

At least it's a ramp, and not a surface lot, huh?!
I just wonder how people and places existed before cars... or how they get along in so many European cities and towns with high-end retail/dining... Also nevermind hopping on a bike or one of the many buses that go through that area. Furthermore, I'm not against cars outright or even parking (as long as its ramps or underground). It just shouldn't be the focus and definitely should not be on the local government to further subsidize parking at the expense of street life and possible commercial space..

min-chi-cbus
Capella Tower
Posts: 3131
Joined: June 1st, 2012, 9:19 am

Re: General Suburb News

Postby min-chi-cbus » February 28th, 2013, 7:34 am

RailBaronYarr wrote:
min-chi-cbus wrote:I tend to agree with you, but Edina has to be realistic: 50th & France, for all its successes, will never be a place most of its clientelle walk to. At least, there isn't enough of a population within walking distance to support the high-end stores that exist there now. There HAS to be parking, and Edina is solving that problem.

At least it's a ramp, and not a surface lot, huh?!
I just wonder how people and places existed before cars... or how they get along in so many European cities and towns with high-end retail/dining... Also nevermind hopping on a bike or one of the many buses that go through that area. Furthermore, I'm not against cars outright or even parking (as long as its ramps or underground). It just shouldn't be the focus and definitely should not be on the local government to further subsidize parking at the expense of street life and possible commercial space..
Maybe they could ease everyone's concerns and surround the parking ramp with condos/apartments, like those ramps near the Guthrie downtown? That seems like a good compromise that keeps the integrity of the area intact and is also completely feasible (money-wise).

kirby96
Union Depot
Posts: 356
Joined: June 4th, 2012, 11:30 am

Re: General Suburb News

Postby kirby96 » February 28th, 2013, 8:54 am

Even stupider: in my experience the existing ramps on 49th 1/2 are never full. The one on the other side of 50th gets full, and that's probably because a lot of drive-in traffic doesn't even know 49th 1/2 is even really there as a part of the 50th and France node. Folks from the burbs drive in wonder why they can't park, and have no idea there are two massive ramps just a block away.

mattaudio
Stone Arch Bridge
Posts: 7941
Joined: June 19th, 2012, 2:04 pm
Location: NORI: NOrth of RIchfield

Re: General Suburb News

Postby mattaudio » February 28th, 2013, 8:56 am

Honestly I didn't know those ramps were even there, north of 50th. The only ramp I could support in this node is one that allows for the Lund's surface lot to get new development.

mamundsen
Wells Fargo Center
Posts: 1112
Joined: November 15th, 2012, 10:01 am

Re: General Suburb News

Postby mamundsen » February 28th, 2013, 9:33 am

Maybe they should be investing in some better signage before spending $7.5 million.

mulad
Moderator
Posts: 2802
Joined: June 4th, 2012, 6:30 pm
Location: Saint Paul
Contact:

Re: General Suburb News

Postby mulad » February 28th, 2013, 9:56 am

Yep.

RailBaronYarr
Capella Tower
Posts: 2702
Joined: September 16th, 2012, 4:31 pm

Re: General Suburb News

Postby RailBaronYarr » February 28th, 2013, 8:52 pm

min-chi-cbus wrote:Maybe they could ease everyone's concerns and surround the parking ramp with condos/apartments, like those ramps near the Guthrie downtown? That seems like a good compromise that keeps the integrity of the area intact and is also completely feasible (money-wise).
Would totally be behind that. I guarantee there's demand for 20s-30s year olds to live in this area. Maybe even some seniors. Heck, they're building a senior apartment building a couple blocks east. I don't care if there is parking. I just don't like a) surface lot parking (the devil), or b) free, city owned ramp parking in place of good urbanism, under the guise of reducing traffic.

Wedgeguy
Capella Tower
Posts: 3785
Joined: June 1st, 2012, 6:59 am

Re: General Suburb News

Postby Wedgeguy » March 1st, 2013, 11:18 am

mattaudio wrote:Honestly I didn't know those ramps were even there, north of 50th. The only ramp I could support in this node is one that allows for the Lund's surface lot to get new development.

The Edina parking ramps are nicely hid away from the main intersection. On is sandwiches between the store fronting France, the Ednia Theater, and Lunds. The other two are back off a block in the NW quadrant near the Walgreens. They don't sit out like many do.

min-chi-cbus
Capella Tower
Posts: 3131
Joined: June 1st, 2012, 9:19 am

Re: General Suburb News

Postby min-chi-cbus » March 1st, 2013, 12:12 pm

Wedgeguy wrote:
mattaudio wrote:Honestly I didn't know those ramps were even there, north of 50th. The only ramp I could support in this node is one that allows for the Lund's surface lot to get new development.

The Edina parking ramps are nicely hid away from the main intersection. On is sandwiches between the store fronting France, the Ednia Theater, and Lunds. The other two are back off a block in the NW quadrant near the Walgreens. They don't sit out like many do.
The ramps north of 50th (next to Walgreens) are not hidden at all, and I think that's what they were referring to. The ones behind the movie theater and Edina Grill are certainly better hidden.

Wedgeguy
Capella Tower
Posts: 3785
Joined: June 1st, 2012, 6:59 am

Re: General Suburb News

Postby Wedgeguy » March 1st, 2013, 12:22 pm

min-chi-cbus wrote:
Wedgeguy wrote:
mattaudio wrote:Honestly I didn't know those ramps were even there, north of 50th. The only ramp I could support in this node is one that allows for the Lund's surface lot to get new development.

The Edina parking ramps are nicely hid away from the main intersection. On is sandwiches between the store fronting France, the Ednia Theater, and Lunds. The other two are back off a block in the NW quadrant near the Walgreens. They don't sit out like many do.
The ramps north of 50th (next to Walgreens) are not hidden at all, and I think that's what they were referring to. The ones behind the movie theater and Edina Grill are certainly better hidden.
If you are driving or walking along 50th and France you would not even know they are there. They do not show as part of the main business district. They are all set off away from the main though fares

twincitizen
Moderator
Posts: 6206
Joined: May 31st, 2012, 7:27 pm
Location: Standish-Ericsson

Re: General Suburb News

Postby twincitizen » March 1st, 2013, 12:26 pm

Nick, can you break this off into a new "50th & France" topic beginning with Phil's post?


Return to “Suburbs”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 11 guests