50th & France - Edina/Minneapolis
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Lunds / US Bank Redevelopment at 50th & France
Sam Black has the deets (and a map of Lunds property empire) over at MSP Biz Journal: http://www.bizjournals.com/twincities/b ... re-at.html
Lunds has quietly been stockpiling property around their existing store at 50th & France (Halifax, technically).
They bought the former Post Office earlier this year, and own several other properties in addition to the grocery store. Their corporate HQ is located right in the middle of all this, in the US Bank-owned office building / bank branch.
US Bank and Lunds are exploring a redevelopment that would involve Lunds buying the US Bank property, razing it, and building a new store and HQ on that site. US Bank would possibly then build a new branch on the current Lunds site. Everything is very preliminary, so it could all fall apart, but I have a feeling they'll figure it out.
While the article does not mention residential as part of this redevelopment scenario, I'd like to believe it's a possibility, considering what they're doing with the Byerlys near Southdale. Why spend all that money acquiring land just to build a new store? And why spend $1.1MM on the Post Office just to have a bigger parking lot or whatever? Lunds seems like they know what they're doing when it comes to land development and maximizing returns on the AAA-location properties they own.
Random thought: if they end up building a parking structure as a part of this (for the store, for residential, whatever) it would be great to integrate the US Bank drive through into the 1st floor of the ramp so it doesn't take up any additional space.
Lunds has quietly been stockpiling property around their existing store at 50th & France (Halifax, technically).
They bought the former Post Office earlier this year, and own several other properties in addition to the grocery store. Their corporate HQ is located right in the middle of all this, in the US Bank-owned office building / bank branch.
US Bank and Lunds are exploring a redevelopment that would involve Lunds buying the US Bank property, razing it, and building a new store and HQ on that site. US Bank would possibly then build a new branch on the current Lunds site. Everything is very preliminary, so it could all fall apart, but I have a feeling they'll figure it out.
While the article does not mention residential as part of this redevelopment scenario, I'd like to believe it's a possibility, considering what they're doing with the Byerlys near Southdale. Why spend all that money acquiring land just to build a new store? And why spend $1.1MM on the Post Office just to have a bigger parking lot or whatever? Lunds seems like they know what they're doing when it comes to land development and maximizing returns on the AAA-location properties they own.
Random thought: if they end up building a parking structure as a part of this (for the store, for residential, whatever) it would be great to integrate the US Bank drive through into the 1st floor of the ramp so it doesn't take up any additional space.
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- Capella Tower
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Re: Lunds / US Bank Redevelopment at 50th & France
I think the current US Bank branch location will be residential on top of the grocery store, and the Lunds HQ will be on the same site as the US Bank branch, basically opposite of what's currently there plus the residential. The current branch/HQ is probably adequate for their needs, or at least the site is, but it's the other location that can't really serve well for residents since there is a strip mall bordering the parking lot and there's at least 6 or 7 businesses that would have to relocate for a large office/residential bldg (large is a relative term). I'm really not sure how they're going to handle the retail to be honest, but I can't see the largest of the buildings being on the current Lunds site.
Fun times though! I spent half of my childhood in that vacinity and it has changed SO much! I remember when Clancy's (a Ma/Pa drug store) still had the malt & burger 50's style shop up top and an arcade down below. Spent many a pretty quarter there buying baseball cards and playing old-fashioned video games (the game was called "Jackal" maybe?).
Fun times though! I spent half of my childhood in that vacinity and it has changed SO much! I remember when Clancy's (a Ma/Pa drug store) still had the malt & burger 50's style shop up top and an arcade down below. Spent many a pretty quarter there buying baseball cards and playing old-fashioned video games (the game was called "Jackal" maybe?).
Re: Lunds / US Bank Redevelopment at 50th & France
My game at Clancys was the Helicopter! all pre parking ramps days etc and Red Barn was the place!
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Re: Lunds / US Bank Redevelopment at 50th & France
I remember when the tornado took out the theater marquee.
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Re: General Suburb News
I thought there was a thread for this, but Edina is still moving forward with their parking plans at 50th & France. Now featuring eminant domain!
http://www.startribune.com/local/west/224165701.html
http://www.startribune.com/local/west/224165701.html
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- Capella Tower
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Re: General Suburb News
Eminent Domain: "the power of the state to take private property for public use with payment of [just] compensation to the owner" -www.dictionary.com
I have a few issues with this, from a legal standpoint, if not an urbanist standpoint:
-this is not a public use (the argument being that driving is a privilege that excludes some members of the social class)
-the ramp may actually benefit other private parties more than the public (the existing businesses or future redevelopment)
-compensation was reportedly FAR from "just" (bldg. was appraised during renovations, not fully operational, and offer was low-balled)
-the City has been investing in alternative forms of transit, only to take over an operating business and build parking spaces
-through word of mouth, I've heard business owners in the area are being aggressively bought out in the form of ever-increasing taxes on their buildings, clearly with the intent of forcing the lowest-yielding business out of the area
Personally, I smell a lawsuit, and they SHOULD go to court as they appear to have a great case against the City of Edina.
I have a few issues with this, from a legal standpoint, if not an urbanist standpoint:
-this is not a public use (the argument being that driving is a privilege that excludes some members of the social class)
-the ramp may actually benefit other private parties more than the public (the existing businesses or future redevelopment)
-compensation was reportedly FAR from "just" (bldg. was appraised during renovations, not fully operational, and offer was low-balled)
-the City has been investing in alternative forms of transit, only to take over an operating business and build parking spaces
-through word of mouth, I've heard business owners in the area are being aggressively bought out in the form of ever-increasing taxes on their buildings, clearly with the intent of forcing the lowest-yielding business out of the area
Personally, I smell a lawsuit, and they SHOULD go to court as they appear to have a great case against the City of Edina.
- mister.shoes
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Re: General Suburb News
I just drove 49 1/2 Street a few minutes ago on my way to work from the dentist that I go to over there. I parked in the ramp on the south side of 49 1/2. The Edina Realty building is already shuttered. The cleaners is obviously empty. Turning both those lots into parking ramps will make that entire street nothing but parking on both sides. What a shame. Could they not add a level or two to the top of the *two* existing ramps? This is dumb. Really dumb.
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- Stone Arch Bridge
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Re: General Suburb News
I've never had trouble finding a spot within a block of where I'm headed. Isn't that good enough? If not, how about we extend a streetcar from Uptown around Calhoun and Harriet, then through Linden Hills, 44th/France, 50th/France? Win.
- mister.shoes
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Re: General Suburb News
That's exactly what came to mind as I thought about those ramps on my drive. Who's to say that all the visitors to 50/France have to come by car? Why not rebuild that portion of the Como-Harriet line? $, obviously, but Edina needs to think outside the parking ramp-shaped box.
The problem with being an introvert online is that no one knows you're just hanging out and listening.
- FISHMANPET
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Re: General Suburb News
Well if all you've got is a hammer, every problem is a nail.
I think tearing down businesses to put up parking in what I consider to be a pretty urban shopping district is like cutting off the nose to spite your face, not seeing the forest for the trees, insert cliched metaphor here.
It demonstrates a pretty short sighted view to go through with this. I think this area can become a transit node in the future (as it once was with streetcars) with walkable shops within a block or two of the main intersection, and dense housing surrounding it.
I think tearing down businesses to put up parking in what I consider to be a pretty urban shopping district is like cutting off the nose to spite your face, not seeing the forest for the trees, insert cliched metaphor here.
It demonstrates a pretty short sighted view to go through with this. I think this area can become a transit node in the future (as it once was with streetcars) with walkable shops within a block or two of the main intersection, and dense housing surrounding it.
Re: General Suburb News
I sort of appreciate the sentiment, but 50th & France caters to high-end, regional retail. It needs to draw from a much larger area than what is easily served by its location on the transit system, and its clientele is less likely to take transit. It's a nice idea, but most people are going to drive here.
As to whether or not they actually need more parking here, I have no idea. And I agree that this is a marginal use of eminent domain. But I assume that they didn't come up with this solution in a vacuum -- presumably it was vetted with the business district.
As to whether or not they actually need more parking here, I have no idea. And I agree that this is a marginal use of eminent domain. But I assume that they didn't come up with this solution in a vacuum -- presumably it was vetted with the business district.
I would say the same thing about many of the solutions proposed on this board.Well if all you've got is a hammer, every problem is a nail.
- FISHMANPET
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Re: General Suburb News
I think there's plenty of room on the periphery to build parking lots. If they replace all the business with parking lots there won't be anybody parking because there will be no more destination retail.
And if I was driving in I'd rather park on the edge anyway, than have to battle the actual 50th & France intersection.
And if I was driving in I'd rather park on the edge anyway, than have to battle the actual 50th & France intersection.
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50th & France
Edina is starting to feel their rightful shame:
http://www.startribune.com/local/west/239339841.html
http://www.startribune.com/local/west/239339841.html
Q. What, what? A. In da butt.
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Re: General Suburb News
^Finally, some sanity. Hopefully some members of the city council now know why it was a bad idea, besides the price. I won't hold my breath though. From what I've heard, the parking issues at 50th and France could be alleviated by adding better signage (if one ramp is full, direct motorists to another nearby) and charging something, anything at all for parking.
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- Capella Tower
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Re: General Suburb News
My guess is that ALL ramps are packed and that's why they want to expand the one that abuts the cleaners, otherwise what point would there be to expand a ramp that's currently never utilized? Besides, most 50th & France frequenters know exactly where all of the parking options are.
Nobody likes to pay for parking -- period -- so I'm not sure how popular an idea it is to charge for parking, although that certainly would potentially solve the cost issue (if there is one). Perhaps they should loosen some of the street parking regulations so that people can park on city streets without a permit, especially from 9:00 a.m. to 9:00 p.m. I realize this would be an inconvenience for existing home owners (I've lived in areas with such regulations), but one could argue that they receive plenty in return in the form of walkable proximity to one of the most popular shopping destinations in the metro.
Nobody likes to pay for parking -- period -- so I'm not sure how popular an idea it is to charge for parking, although that certainly would potentially solve the cost issue (if there is one). Perhaps they should loosen some of the street parking regulations so that people can park on city streets without a permit, especially from 9:00 a.m. to 9:00 p.m. I realize this would be an inconvenience for existing home owners (I've lived in areas with such regulations), but one could argue that they receive plenty in return in the form of walkable proximity to one of the most popular shopping destinations in the metro.
- mister.shoes
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Re: General Suburb News
Anecdotally, this is very much not true. Even on a Friday/Saturday evening when we've gone to a movie we can get a spot in the ramp behind the theater. We might end up on the top level, but we find a spot. I can't possibly imagine that the ramps on the north side of 49 1/2 are completely full. I've lived with a couple miles of 50th and France since 2005, have been over there for various reasons at various times of day/week, and have never once had to use one of those northernmost ramps. I'd love to see numbers for the absolute busiest times of the year before I believe that more parking is needed in that area. All we ever hear is "there's nowhere to park!" without any data to prove it.My guess is that ALL ramps are packed.
The problem with being an introvert online is that no one knows you're just hanging out and listening.
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- Stone Arch Bridge
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Re: General Suburb News
How true. Most people don't like to pay for gas or insurance for their car either. Or, beyond that, most people don't like to pay when they go out to dinner or go shopping either. What makes car storage so special that the costs should be borne by others regardless of if they benefit from it?Nobody likes to pay for parking -- period
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- Capella Tower
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Re: General Suburb News
Great point, charge for parking, I'm sure chaos won't ensue.
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- Capella Tower
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Re: General Suburb News
Then why do they feel the need to build yet another expensive (free-of-charge) ramp? Clearly at some point during the week they are full. I can't think of any other reason they'd want to blow money on yet another ramp unless there was SOME parking crunch.Anecdotally, this is very much not true. Even on a Friday/Saturday evening when we've gone to a movie we can get a spot in the ramp behind the theater. We might end up on the top level, but we find a spot. I can't possibly imagine that the ramps on the north side of 49 1/2 are completely full. I've lived with a couple miles of 50th and France since 2005, have been over there for various reasons at various times of day/week, and have never once had to use one of those northernmost ramps. I'd love to see numbers for the absolute busiest times of the year before I believe that more parking is needed in that area. All we ever hear is "there's nowhere to park!" without any data to prove it.My guess is that ALL ramps are packed.
Anecdotally, I used to live nearby as well, and know the ramps weren't always full.
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