Rush Line Corridor BRT

Roads - Rails - Sidewalks - Bikeways
mattaudio
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Re: Rush Line Corridor

Postby mattaudio » May 20th, 2014, 12:55 pm

Yep, the old Northern Pacific Skally Line which ran from St. Paul to Duluth by way of Hinckley (where it crossed the GN), Moose Lake (where it crossed the Soo), and Carlton (where it met up with the old Northern Pacific lines to Brainerd).

After the Northern Pacific and Great Northern combined in 1970, the mainline to Duluth became the ex-GN corridor (now the Hinckley Sub and future NLX route) from Coon Creek Jct north of Minneapolis to Duluth by way of Superior.

bptenor
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Re: Rush Line Corridor

Postby bptenor » May 20th, 2014, 4:34 pm

Yes, the Bruce Vento ROW.

David Greene
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Re: Rush Line Corridor

Postby David Greene » May 20th, 2014, 5:06 pm

That's one of several trails I haven't ridden yet. Can anyone familiar with the area comment on the appropriateness of LRT on that alignment. I'm all for east metro LRT if it makes sense. What are the anchors in White Bear Lake?

mamundsen
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Re: Rush Line Corridor

Postby mamundsen » May 20th, 2014, 5:22 pm

From the website:

Does this proposed route include recreational trails and the Bruce Vento Nature Sanctuary?

Ramsey County Regional Railroad Authority (RCRRA) purchased the abandoned section of the rail alignment between downtown St. Paul and White Bear Lake to preserve the corridor for a future transit use. Since acquiring the property, RCRRA has permitted the installation of the Bruce Vento Regional Trail (Vento Trail) as an interim use. The popular Vento Trail will be maintained. In most instances it will be co-located with the identified transit use. If sufficient right-of-way is not available, the Vento Trail will be relocated in an adjacent corridor to maintain trail continuity.

acs
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Re: Rush Line Corridor

Postby acs » May 20th, 2014, 6:16 pm

If SWLRT has taught us anything, its to take claims like this with a healthy dose of skepticism.

Also, somebody really needs to explain to the east metro planners what BRT is and isn't (ahem, Red Rock).

mulad
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Re: Rush Line Corridor

Postby mulad » May 28th, 2014, 8:42 pm

I went to this meeting earlier tonight. Some meeting materials are posted here:

http://www.rushline.org/#!transit-study/c1zhl

They're specifically looking at the two corridors of I-35/I-35E (plus a little off-highway travel at the north end) from Forest Lake to St. Paul, and the Bruce Vento Trail corridor from White Bear Lake to St. Paul. The other corridors had been discarded in an earlier 2008 or 2009 Alternatives Analysis study. I see a link in Google, but the Rush Line website has been redesigned and the link is now dead. Did anyone save it off somewhere?

Always fun to know that you're five years too late to the party, or five years too early.

mattaudio
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Re: Rush Line Corridor

Postby mattaudio » May 28th, 2014, 8:53 pm

It seems so weird that they're studying transit to White Bear Lake (about 12 miles) and Forest Lake (nearly 30) as part of the same process.... wouldn't it make sense to define requirements before choosing a route or mode?

mulad
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Re: Rush Line Corridor

Postby mulad » May 28th, 2014, 8:53 pm

Yes.

Silophant
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Re: Rush Line Corridor (Alternatives Analysis)

Postby Silophant » August 26th, 2014, 10:07 am

Travel patterns surprise Rush Line consultants. Can anyone with a F-C subscription summarize this article quick? I'm really curious to know what the surprise is.

twincitizen
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Re: Rush Line Corridor (Alternatives Analysis)

Postby twincitizen » August 26th, 2014, 10:41 am

Silophant wrote:Travel patterns surprise Rush Line consultants. Can anyone with a F-C subscription summarize this article quick? I'm really curious to know what the surprise is.
That people aren't really heading downtown so much [because "downtown" in this case is St. Paul]

Silophant
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Re: Rush Line Corridor (Alternatives Analysis)

Postby Silophant » August 26th, 2014, 11:06 am

That's... not that surprising, to me at least.

mattaudio
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Re: Rush Line Corridor (Alternatives Analysis)

Postby mattaudio » August 26th, 2014, 11:36 am

More reason why service should interline St. Paul but terminate in Minneapolis. They could do this if it was commuter rail or bus rather easily. If it was LRT, they could interline, but I can't imagine people taking a half hour train to St. Paul then being excited about a 50 minute ride to Minneapolis.

acs
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Re: Rush Line Corridor (Alternatives Analysis)

Postby acs » October 16th, 2014, 4:04 pm

Locked:
http://finance-commerce.com/2014/10/rus ... neighbors/

The title implies concerns about the Bruce Vento trail route, yet the picture caption talks about a route farther east on White Bear Ave. I didn't even know an alignment that far east was even under consideration.

Tcmetro
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Re: Rush Line Corridor (Alternatives Analysis)

Postby Tcmetro » October 16th, 2014, 4:34 pm

Recently they held a couple of neighborhood walks in the St. Paul and Maplewood areas of the line. There are a number of issues with the ROW between Maryland Ave and Hwy 36. The ROW in this area carries the Bruce Vento bike trail and is pretty much running mid-block, in place of an alley. I think a lot of the neighbors are going to be heavily against any transit route here.

There are a number of options that I think could work:
1. Reroute the trail to English St.
2. Acquire the properties along the 3-block stretch of English St between Nebraska and Larpenteur and run trains on the east side of the street and use the bike trail as a buffer between the rail line and the houses on McAfee.
3. Operate along Prosperity in the center of the roadway or perhaps elevated along White Bear to Larpenteur, then surface running to Maplewood Mall.

Suburban Outcast
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Re: Rush Line Corridor (Alternatives Analysis)

Postby Suburban Outcast » October 16th, 2014, 4:38 pm

The density just isn't there and given the 35E expansion, I doubt this will ever come into fruition except maybe a fancier express bus. WBL is dense for an eastern suburb, but it's still less dense than Robbinsdale or SLP.

Maplewood really isn't too dense either; if WBL's downtown was where Maplewood Mall is then I could have seen a possible LRT line. Commuter rail doesn't seem likely as there aren't enough Forest Lake-St Paul commuters to support it. Using funds for aBRT in the East Side that can be extended to Maplewood Mall and/or Century College later on seems like a better way to spend transit funds.

Vagueperson
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Re: Rush Line Corridor (Alternatives Analysis)

Postby Vagueperson » November 3rd, 2014, 2:38 pm

Apparently there will be another walking tour, this time through Swede Hollow, on Saturday, Nov. 22 from 3:00 to 4:30 pm.
The Friends of Swede Hollow have been circulating a petition to not even have this part of the Bruce Vento Trail studied, but they've been told repeatedly that it legally must be studied. People involved in the project have said it is extremely unlikely that the LRT line would go through Swede Hollow, but as we've seen in the past - once a route is selected it can be hard to sway anyone from it. I'm very curious what the realistic alternative LRT routes would be - how it would get into downtown.
I would personally like to see it become the extension of the Riverview corridor or even the Green Line, but I'm not sure how to get it to the Union Depot unless it goes through the Bruce Vento Nature sanctuary. Maybe it could come into downtown on 9th street or come over Lafayette Road - that sounds like a mess.

mulad
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Re: Rush Line Corridor (Alternatives Analysis)

Postby mulad » November 4th, 2014, 4:19 pm

I just got a notice that some open houses that were to occur on November 13th, 18th, and 20th have been postponed until January. I don't see anything one way or the other about the walking tour for the 22nd.

froggie
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Re: Rush Line Corridor (Alternatives Analysis)

Postby froggie » November 4th, 2014, 5:55 pm

I would personally like to see it become the extension of the Riverview corridor or even the Green Line, but I'm not sure how to get it to the Union Depot unless it goes through the Bruce Vento Nature sanctuary. Maybe it could come into downtown on 9th street or come over Lafayette Road - that sounds like a mess.
My old concept went through Swede Hollow, but I've sketched out a possible idea using the Kellogg bridge, Mounds Blvd, and East 7th.

Tcmetro
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Re: Rush Line Corridor (Alternatives Analysis)

Postby Tcmetro » November 4th, 2014, 9:50 pm

mulad wrote:I just got a notice that some open houses that were to occur on November 13th, 18th, and 20th have been postponed until January. I don't see anything one way or the other about the walking tour for the 22nd.
I talked with someone from the RCRRA at the Riverview Corridor open house last week. He said that the meetings were pushed back to January, because they are looking at some other/new alternative routings.

Vagueperson
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Re: Rush Line Corridor (Alternatives Analysis)

Postby Vagueperson » November 4th, 2014, 10:25 pm

Gosh, the suggested route of Kellogg, Mounds Blvd, and 7th would involve some sharp turns - particularly around Metro State.
While I personally don't want it to go through Swede Hollow to preserve a wonderful East Side nature oasis, I DO want it to go by Payne Ave and Phalen Blvd. Going up Kellogg or White Bear Ave would bypass this very walkable space ("development oriented transit"). Phalen Blvd seems to be a good route based upon its width and access to jobs, as well.
Perhaps south down Olive or Mississippi to cross into the northern portion of downtown. Maybe it could turn down Desoto, take a bridge over to Kittson and meet up with the Green Line. Desoto isn't very wide, however - better on Edgerton or lower Payne.


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