Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Roads - Rails - Sidewalks - Bikeways
EOst
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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby EOst » October 6th, 2015, 7:50 pm

I'm still very disappointed that they rejected a protected bike lane through the underpass in favor of more street parking. The speeds that drivers sustain through this area really make a good bikeway necessary; a buffer isn't enough. This is adjacent to a light rail station! This shouldn't be a hide-and-ride.

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FISHMANPET
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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby FISHMANPET » October 6th, 2015, 7:53 pm

What would you (the general you, not you specifically Alex) do if you had complete freedom to move that Taco Bell around? Maybe build a level curb all the way up to 21st and get rid of the parking access on that side? I'm thinking even now, you could pretty easily make 20th Ave a Two-Way up to the Taco Bell entrance on that side, or maybe even up to the corner or something, and then you'd retain their access and be free to do whatever you want on the other side.
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mattaudio
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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby mattaudio » October 7th, 2015, 8:45 am

If I were to back up the discussion a little, I would have even given them the right to build a drive-thru in exchange for playing ball on siting the structure in a way that supports undoing this intersection CF.

fehler
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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby fehler » October 7th, 2015, 9:47 am

When I look at this plan, I see "They're going to close Minnehaha Avenue for a Taco Bell!". Almost as ridiculous as "They're going to close Nicollet Avenue for a K-Mart!".

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FISHMANPET
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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby FISHMANPET » October 7th, 2015, 9:51 am

Yeah except that's totally not what's happening here...
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intercomnut
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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby intercomnut » October 7th, 2015, 11:50 am

fehler wrote:When I look at this plan, I see "They're going to close Minnehaha Avenue for a Taco Bell!". Almost as ridiculous as "They're going to close Nicollet Avenue for a K-Mart!".
Like Peter said, that's not reality. They're closing Minnehaha because it that little section makes the intersection too complicated and makes for terrible geometry. That makes EVERYONE less safe. This is actually gonna make it a little harder to access the Taco Bell.

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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby mulad » October 7th, 2015, 1:12 pm

Debating the existing design, I have to say that I'm not a big fan of the median between straight-ahead and left-turning traffic from eastbound Franklin onto northbound 20th Avenue -- the traffic count diagram says there are 18 vehicles making that turn at the peak hour as things stand today, so I don't see much need to retain an extra left-turn lane just for one car every 3.3 minutes when it's at its worst.

I'm also not a big fan of having a median separating the left turns from eastbound Franklin onto northbound Cedar, but I guess that helps force straight-ahead traffic to narrow down before reaching the other side of the intersection where Franklin is almost immediately down to one lane.

mattaudio
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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby mattaudio » October 7th, 2015, 1:36 pm

They just need to flat-out eliminate the curb cut from Taco Bell onto Minnehaha.

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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby trigonalmayhem » October 7th, 2015, 2:46 pm

Yeah the drunks headed there at 2 am will just drive over the curb anyway so NBD.

gpete
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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby gpete » February 10th, 2016, 10:51 am

This project was presented to the Seward Community Development Committee last night. The project was easily approved by the 50 or so people in attendance, but there was a lot of skepticism.

People are skeptical about the County's traffic counts. Specifically, I heard many people worried that eliminating the option to turn left from westbound Franklin onto Minnehaha will divert SO MUCH traffic down some of the quiet residential side streets (21st, 22nd, and 23rd Aves). I think the concerns are overblown, but it was a common concern.

I specifically asked about the possibility of getting guaranteed walk signals for pedestrians (i.e. no beg buttons) and leading pedestrian interval. The county reps said they would be considered, but no guarantee.

County Commissioner Peter McLaughlin was in attendance for the entire meeting. He didn't say anything but was just there to observe and listen.

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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby froggie » February 10th, 2016, 11:29 am

Guaranteed walk signal should be easily programmable. They'd probably have to re-run the traffic simulation to see if an LPI could be included.

I heard that there was also an exhibit on suggestions for that area that were submitted. The project manager (whom I've known for years) emailed me a couple weeks ago asking if he could include the proposal I published on Streets.MN a year and a half ago. He also had a sketch of Joe Scott's proposal (that Joe recently posted), but was unsuccessful in contacting Joe at the time.

On a somewhat related note, I asked the project manager about tweaking the curb on the east side of Cedar between Franklin and 20th to widen the MUP there. The county is open to that and his reply to me suggested it wouldn't be a budget-buster.

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Mdcastle
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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby Mdcastle » February 10th, 2016, 12:08 pm

Without observing it myself, I'd second froggies observations that
1) Ped Recall should be possible without any further studies, given the presence of refuge islands, the widths of the streets, and the volume of vehicular traffic. As I've noted many times, push-buttons will be installed regardless because it's an ADA requirement and needed to generate a ped call if there's no vehicle around.
2) Leading Ped would most definately need a new simulation run (if it wasn't planned to be included in the first place)

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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby froggie » February 10th, 2016, 2:49 pm

Project manager confirmed to me that the city is the entity that will make the call on signal timings.

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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby mattaudio » June 14th, 2016, 9:08 am

This project may be delayed until 2017 because the bid for concrete work came in above budget?

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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby David Greene » June 14th, 2016, 11:00 am

We fricking study things to death in this country. Know what the easiest, most accurate and least expensive study to perform for signal changes is? Just implement them and see what happens. It's not like it's hard to reprogram if things go wrong.

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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby talindsay » June 14th, 2016, 1:28 pm

David Greene wrote:We fricking study things to death in this country. Know what the easiest, most accurate and least expensive study to perform for signal changes is? Just implement them and see what happens. It's not like it's hard to reprogram if things go wrong.
You must not have lived along Hiawatha for the past twelve years.

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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby David Greene » June 14th, 2016, 3:35 pm

Are you referring to the LRT signaling? My understanding is that modern equipment is easier to reprogram and what was used was substandard even in its day.

twincitizen
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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby twincitizen » July 13th, 2016, 10:27 am

mattaudio wrote:This project may be delayed until 2017 because the bid for concrete work came in above budget?
http://finance-commerce.com/2016/07/hig ... enue-work/
When you first read the headline & lede and see "Bids came in 30% over budget!", it seems entirely reasonable that this would be delayed & re-bid next year.

But when you continue reading and see that the entire project only costs $1MM, it's pretty infuriating (and implausible, really) that they couldn't find a measly $300,000 to move forward this year. If that is truly the case, people should be pretty pissed off. Now that we're into mid-July and the decision has already been made, there's probably nothing that can be done at this point to get this moving in 2016. Bummer. Over $300,000.

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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby Mcgizz » July 13th, 2016, 10:01 pm

I don't mean to beat a dead horse, but I will anyway. The county couldn't find $300,000 dollars? What the eff? That is a real shame. I hope they don't push this down the road over a small amount of money.

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Re: Cedar - Franklin - Minnehaha Intersection

Postby grant1simons2 » February 27th, 2017, 11:21 am



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