Green Line / Central Corridor construction thread (archive)

[twincitizen]

What is the rationale for the necessity of these new ramps? Are they developing surface parking into buildings elsewhere? Eliminating other parking? Growing the state workforce in this area (with folks who don't live in St. Paul and can't take transit)?

Why is there all of the sudden this demand for more parking for state employees? They should at least have to explain that.

[RailBaronYarr]

Right now it is very difficult to find parking relatively close to the Capitol or SOB.

But > 800 spaces? Dang...

Maybe that's because it isn't priced appropriately?

Given declining VMT and demographic trends and that $1 billion light rail with 2 stations nearby you would think this would have been a no-brainer to say no to...

[Tcmetro]

Honestly, the bus system in St. Paul sucks (severe lack of commuter routes; poor local service) and the Capitol is already on the periphery of Downtown, so I am not too surprised about this.

[gpete]

There was funding provided during this legislative session to design and build a new legislative office building on top of a parking lot behind the Capitol (to the north). That will displace 100 parking spaces or so...

[David Greene]

It sounds like this is mostly being driven by redevelopment of the Sears site. Currently the state leases a lot of parking there for employees. That lease expires in August and won't be renewed.

[Rich]

In essence they seem to be replacing 835 surface lot spaces with 880 ramp spaces. So 45 additional spaces. And the $51.67 a month user fee will increase.

[mattaudio]

Good to hear it will increase. If the user fees increase to the market rate, seems to me like $22 million in public bonding would not be necessary.

[MNdible]

Good to hear it will increase. If the user fees increase to the market rate, seems to me like $22 million in public bonding would not be necessary.

Just because you have a revenue source doesn't mean that you wouldn't bond to build it. I have money to pay my mortgage bill every month, but that doesn't mean I don't need a mortgage.

[MNdible]

[Also, this should be split off into its own thread.]

[Tom H.]

(Accidentally posted this earlier on the SWLRT thread)

I have a question for someone who may know more about the bus operations planned along the Washington Ave Transit Mall:

How will the 16 run along the WATM? The bus bumpouts remain between the bridges on the western edge of the mall, but for the remainder of the mall, it's just a two-lane street. Many of the fliers at local businesses in Stadium Village show the tracks as "LRT/Bus" on the cross-sectional diagrams. Will the buses run on the tracks, or along the auxiliary lanes? Those lanes are usually marked as "Bike / Emergency vehicle" lanes in the diagrams.

There are also no bus stop facilities along the mall (shelters, signs, bumpouts, etc.). The Central Corridor Bus Improvement Plan lists the West Bank station as a transfer point between Green Line and Route 16, but I'm not sure how the buses would let people on or off at the station. With right-side exit doors, the buses would need to cross over like at the 46th St BRT station, creating quite the safety headache with oncoming LRT vehicles.

I just can't figure out how this is going to work in my head. This will only be exacerbated by the fact that not only will the 16 be running along the mall, but many of the SWT and MVTA express buses will likely utilize the mall as well.

[mulad]

I have been very confused about the claim that buses will run on the LRT guideway too. I've never understood what that meant, for basically the same reasons you describe.

[MSPtoMKE]

(Accidentally posted this earlier on the SWLRT thread)

There are also no bus stop facilities along the mall (shelters, signs, bumpouts, etc.). The Central Corridor Bus Improvement Plan lists the West Bank station as a transfer point between Green Line and Route 16, but I'm not sure how the buses would let people on or off at the station. With right-side exit doors, the buses would need to cross over like at the 46th St BRT station, creating quite the safety headache with oncoming LRT vehicles.

I just can't figure out how this is going to work in my head. This will only be exacerbated by the fact that not only will the 16 be running along the mall, but many of the SWT and MVTA express buses will likely utilize the mall as well.

Buses will not actually be stopping at any Light Rail platforms, they will serve adjacent stops. In the case of the West Bank, buses will stop at the existing bus stop near the beginning of the Mississippi River Bridge. But perhaps you mean East Bank, since you are asking about the Washington Ave. Transit Mall? I, too, do not know the details on why buses are supposedly going to run on the tracks, but they will undoubtably still serve bus stops along the sidewalk. Perhaps they will run on the tracks while in motion, but pull over to the side when at a bus stop. I imagine buses would stop at Coffman Union, and one more stop at about Harvard before Washington Ave. then becomes open to all vehicles at Walnut. The 16 will not serve either East Bank or West Bank stations outside of the overnight hours, it is proposed to end at Oak St. and University.

[lordmoke]

For those curious about what happened with the vehicles damaging the tracks in DT Saint Paul a while back:
http://www.startribune.com/local/east/210601481.html

[Nick]

Blue Line was out in Downtown Minneapolis today, presumably because they were connecting the catenary for the Green Line. Sidebar: Why doesn't Firefox think catenary is a word?


IMG_3553 by UrbanMSP, on Flickr

[UptownSport]

See both are up over 35W flyover.
UofM spur????

[Tom H.]

If only. It could only go as far as the West Bank station at this point, I think. Caternary is still absent for stretches up to the East Bank station, and I don't know if all the necessary TPSS's are installed to make that possible anyway.

[UptownSport]

That'd be a dream come true!
Saw they must've just put up both caternary over 35W flyover.

I've seen tpss's installed in various spots- You'd think they'd start on West end and work East so trains could get rolling!

[LRV Op Dude]

Rail Grinding on METRO Green Line on University Ave.

[commissioner]

If only. It could only go as far as the West Bank station at this point, I think. Caternary is still absent for stretches up to the East Bank station, and I don't know if all the necessary TPSS's are installed to make that possible anyway.

Pretty much all the TPSS's are installed afaik, but except for probably the one at Prior, Raymond and where the Blue and Green lines meet I doubt any of them are actually hooked up

[Tom H.]

Okay, good to know about the TPSS's. I noticed on the bus this morning that, while the caternary wire (i.e. the top wire) is strung at least as far as the West Bank Station, no power lines (the ones that hang from the caternary) are wired up yet in the vicinity of WBS.