Green Line / Central Corridor construction thread (archive)

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bandar_seri_begawan
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Re: Central Corridor LRT

Postby bandar_seri_begawan » July 6th, 2012, 10:58 am

Has Metro Transit considered the possibility of using four car trains? I'm curious as to whether this could work if they had the first and fourth train overhang the platforms halfway.

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Andrew_F
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Re: Central Corridor LRT

Postby Andrew_F » July 6th, 2012, 3:00 pm

bandar_seri_begawan wrote:Has Metro Transit considered the possibility of using four car trains? I'm curious as to whether this could work if they had the first and fourth train overhang the platforms halfway.
4-car trains are too long for downtown blocks.

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Re: Central Corridor LRT

Postby mulad » July 6th, 2012, 3:23 pm

I think it'd work, but you just have to be willing to block traffic -- a pretty hard sell. However, the better solution is just to increase service frequency.

But, on a related thought, I've often wondered why the new Siemens LRVs are being made the same length as the existing Bombardier ones. Since the control systems are incompatible, they could have bought vehicles 1.5x the length and just run 1- or 2-car trains with those longer LRVs. It'd increase capacity a bit, since an extra pair of cabs would be removed. The size of the maintenance bays at the Franklin and downtown Saint Paul operations facilities might have constrained things, though.

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Re: Central Corridor LRT

Postby MNdible » July 6th, 2012, 3:26 pm

Wouldn't longer cars impact turning movements?

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Re: Central Corridor LRT

Postby mulad » July 6th, 2012, 4:39 pm

You just need to add another segment to the train and another articulation joint. As long as the length between the trucks/bogies is fairly short, it'll work.

Browsing through images online, Siemens makes longer vehicles for lines outside the U.S., but I haven't found an American service using them. Maybe it has something to do with our crash regulations...

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Re: Central Corridor LRT

Postby mulad » July 6th, 2012, 8:43 pm

Oh, I figured I'd mention that I was on an eastbound #3 bus today which skipped past the zig-zag up the ramp to Cedar Avenue and back down again on the southeast side -- Not sure if the driver just missed the turn or if they've officially decided that the turn is too sharp at the bottom of that ramp.

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Re: New Vikings LRT Station

Postby mulad » July 10th, 2012, 6:00 pm

Thanks for thinking so highly of "my" idea -- it was actually mattaudio who suggested it. This isn't a topic that's really been on my mind, though I think adding a center platform is probably the right thing to do. The big question is, who would pay for it? Perhaps there will be enough contingency funding leftover from CCLRT that it could be done. We'll have to see. I think the contingency money from the Hiawatha Line's Full Funding Grant Agreement only got used up this past year as part of the purchase of the new Siemens LRVs, so there's a good chance that at least something will be available.

Right now, I mostly just get annoyed that the ticket vending machines and Go-To readers are near the center of the platform. I'd really like to see Go-To pedestals right at the entrance to the platform. But there are a bunch of stations that seem to have weird placement of the TVMs and readers...

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Re: Central Corridor LRT

Postby mulad » July 10th, 2012, 7:55 pm

Did a little scouting of the line today. The Hamline intersection has rails embedded and is open to north-south traffic. I think rails had also been installed at Victoria (though not anywhere on either side there). Pavement is finished and striped on the south side of University from Mackubin to Marion (not quite open yet, but really really close), and curbing is installed on the north side of University between Marion and Rice. In other words, very soon there will be new pavement on at least one side of University all the way from 29th Ave in Minneapolis to Rice Street in St. Paul.

I also saw LED lighting installed on some of the metal framework at the Union Depot station.

My #3 bus late in the day correctly zigged and zagged at Cedar Avenue in Minneapolis. There were a bunch of new signs with "BUS" and an arrow pointing left or right to remind drivers to turn.

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Re: New Vikings LRT Station

Postby LRV Op Dude » July 10th, 2012, 8:10 pm

by mulad
The big question is, who would pay for it?
I would assume that the money would come from what is set aside for the new stadium. According to the concept pictures there is going to be a new parking structure next to the station.
by mulad
Right now, I mostly just get annoyed that the ticket vending machines and Go-To readers are near the center of the platform. I'd really like to see Go-To pedestals right at the entrance to the platform. But there are a bunch of stations that seem to have weird placement of the TVMs and readers...
I agree with that. I wonder if that has to do with the platform expansion. To save money they did not move the GO-TO readers.
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Re: New Vikings LRT Station

Postby mulad » July 10th, 2012, 8:28 pm

Yeah, platform expansion caused some weirdness, though the Metrodome platform was full-length from the start, if my memory serves...

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Re: Central Corridor LRT

Postby spectre000 » July 10th, 2012, 9:31 pm

I've been wondering, does anyone have a guess as to how much of the actual rail line has been installed so far? I haven't traveled the route in awhile. I'll take a guess and say they've got at least 50% of it installed. If anyone can complete this map that would be awesome. I'm pretty sure all the rail is done from Westgate to Hamline. I know what's been installed in downtown as well. Anyone have more information about the progress in Minneapolis or the eastern portion of the Green Line.

Image

Rail installed so far in green (I think).
Image

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Re: Central Corridor LRT

Postby mulad » July 10th, 2012, 10:10 pm

That's pretty close. There's rail running between the junction with the Hiawatha Line down to the West Bank station, though I don't think there's any actually next to the platform yet. The junction/interlocking with Hiawatha is also a work in progress -- they've got the switch for the eastbound CCLRT track installed, plus one crossover just southeast of that between the Hiawatha tracks. I think there are two more crossovers plus a switch for the westbound CCLRT track that still need to be installed in the vicinity, though.

The track might not quite reach Hamline -- I think the space between Pascal and Hamline has been used for storing the welded rail segments. My fuzzy memory tells me that track installation is in progress between a bit west of Hamline and a bit east of Lexington, though I wasn't able to catch the exact spots when I went past today. Track hasn't been installed quite yet at Lexington itself -- they're still reconstructing the roadway on the north side.

There are also a couple of crossover points east of Westgate that will take a long time to finish, but I'm not sure it's worth worrying about that on a map. The spot that jumps out in my mind is right by the McDonald's between the Raymond Ave station and Cretin/Vandalia.

There is some rail installed along Washington Avenue, just from Oak Street west to Harvard, I think. There have been curved rails at the intersection of 29th and University since late May/early June, but nothing else yet (at least as of last week when I went by).

Humming along, but in fairly random fits and starts...

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Re: New Vikings LRT Station

Postby MNdible » July 11th, 2012, 2:26 pm

Remember that this platform is built on top of an underground parking garage, so any changes to track locations are going to cause problems.

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Re: New Vikings LRT Station

Postby Andrew_F » July 11th, 2012, 8:04 pm

I don't see the attraction of island platforms. Realistically, how much extra time does it take to go down to the end of the platform and across? I see the convenience of a single platform, but I don't think that slight convenience is worth the cost... The limited dollars we have could probably be better spent elsewhere.

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Re: New Vikings LRT Station

Postby mulad » July 11th, 2012, 9:43 pm

Well, it'd be about the length of a downtown city block. 60-90 seconds.

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Re: Central Corridor LRT

Postby Tcmetro » July 12th, 2012, 3:55 am

Here is the latest CCMC presentation, with a good number of construction pics, and a 58% completion rate for May.

http://metrocouncil.org/transportation/ ... 711PPT.pdf

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Re: New Vikings LRT Station

Postby MSPtoMKE » July 12th, 2012, 8:02 pm

Besides the concept renderings, has there been any indication in print that the Metrodome station will be significantly changed? A center platform here would be nice, but I do think it would be pretty difficult to change it now. You would have to tear out at least one of the current tracks to move them farther apart. I am not sure if the disruption and cost for that would be worth saving a minute or two for the people who are transferring between the two lines. A lot of the concept renderings show some sort of canopy over the station, but I don't see how that is really necessary. Maybe the platforms could be enlarged a bit.
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Re: New Vikings LRT Station

Postby min-chi-cbus » July 13th, 2012, 8:00 am

I haven't heard anything to that effect either. I was actually wondering where this notion came from in the 1st place!

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Re: New Vikings LRT Station

Postby mattaudio » July 13th, 2012, 9:03 am

I think in the other thread it was noted there's no plans as part of CCLRT. My guess is the Vikings stadium plan may make relatively minor cosmetic changes to the plaza, but I can't imagine there will be a change in the platforms. I was just saying I wish there was hypothetically a center platform to facilitate blue/green transfers.

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Re: Central Corridor LRT

Postby mulad » July 13th, 2012, 1:51 pm

New video from the City of Saint Paul on the construction progress:

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fm7FXvgnPDQ[/youtube]


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