D Line - Chicago-Fremont/Emerson Rapid Bus

Roads - Rails - Sidewalks - Bikeways
RailBaronYarr
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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby RailBaronYarr » January 3rd, 2018, 12:54 pm

During congested hours, signal preemption only helps if the bus is the next in line to cross the intersection when it would have otherwise turned red. And even then, if the lanes are stopped on the other side of the street, a bus shouldn't use the preemption to enter the intersection and block the box (though they sometimes do). The bus bulbs will be a much bigger factor IMO; I routinely see SOVs stuck in traffic and obstinately refuse to let buses back in the thru-lane because they might miss the next green light. I think it's probably true that transit advocates in MSP call for bus lanes more than is generally warranted, but 7th St is not one of those places.

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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby mattaudio » January 3rd, 2018, 3:03 pm

Skip queues work well with signal preemption in places where there's a left or right turn lane. The bus can enter the turn lane and then use it to proceed straight on a special signal.

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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby Qhaberl » January 4th, 2018, 2:42 pm

Are there left or right turn areas and seventh and eighth Street in downtown? I like the idea of the buses being able to get to the front of the queue.


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Bakken2016
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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby Bakken2016 » January 19th, 2018, 2:44 pm


billhelm
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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby billhelm » January 19th, 2018, 2:49 pm

I know it's only 2 blocks from 46th but a little surprised they went with 52nd over 48th, considering it's a likely destination for some riders given the commercial node there.

Bakken2016
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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby Bakken2016 » January 19th, 2018, 3:04 pm

billhelm wrote:
January 19th, 2018, 2:49 pm
I know it's only 2 blocks from 46th but a little surprised they went with 52nd over 48th, considering it's a likely destination for some riders given the commercial node there.
They are doing public input on the draft, so I would make sure you suggest adding it in!

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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby mister.shoes » January 23rd, 2018, 2:00 pm

I was pretty surprised to see 48th left out, but if this is a far-side stop (southbound), it's really just a single block walk to get into the business node. Northbound, on the other hand, is going to feel extra long having to walk back south (and across 46th!) after passing through.
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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby amiller92 » January 23rd, 2018, 3:04 pm

If you're doing one of 48th or 52nd, you do 48th, easy.

I'd be interested in the number of transfers at 46th, because if it's relatively small (don't know how to define that), I'd say put the stop at 47th and make both transfers and 48th & Chicago travelers walk a block. That might not work for the differently abled, though.

Really, the way it works out you just bite the bullet and have a spot where stops are two blocks apart.

If it's going to be a far side stop at 46th northbound, sure would be nice if they could make the cemetary add a sidewalk.

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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby Silophant » January 23rd, 2018, 5:06 pm

There's stops at both 24th and 26th, so it's not like there's no other place on the line where stops are only two blocks apart. (Plus, y'know, downtown.)

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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby twincitizen » January 23rd, 2018, 6:38 pm

If you feel strongly about the lack of a station at 48th, I’d urge you to get involved and contact your elected officials immediately (Jeremy Schroeder most importantly). Remember that this project is being planned by Metro Transit staff. For better or worse (almost always worse), Metro Transit’s planners constantly have to walk on eggshells due to the organization not having any direct political power or elected representatives. Every decision they make can be second guessed or killed by the involvement of an elected body (city, county, state). Usually this means that they (staff) are not going to take the lead on pushing anything remotely controversial. In this case, the “something controversial” is that several parking spaces would have to be removed. While that seems like a slam dunk trade-off to anyone on this forum, surely it is not desirable to business owners and driving customers who are just fine with the status quo.

Long story short, siting a station at 48th is an uphill battle, and no one here should expect Metro Transit staff people to be the leaders on an issue like this. They simply don’t have the political backing necessary for change. Leadership on these types of issues (transit improvement that impacts literally anything) has to come from elected officials and neighborhood orgs, and then maybe that position can become the staff position.

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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby Qhaberl » January 24th, 2018, 8:04 am

I'm sure it's already been answered, but can someone tell me if these will be articulated buses or standard buses?


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Silophant
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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby Silophant » January 24th, 2018, 9:55 am

The D Line will use 60' articulated buses like the C Line.

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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby Bakken2016 » January 24th, 2018, 10:11 am

twincitizen wrote:
January 23rd, 2018, 6:38 pm
If you feel strongly about the lack of a station at 48th, I’d urge you to get involved and contact your elected officials immediately (Jeremy Schroeder most importantly). Remember that this project is being planned by Metro Transit staff. For better or worse (almost always worse), Metro Transit’s planners constantly have to walk on eggshells due to the organization not having any direct political power or elected representatives. Every decision they make can be second guessed or killed by the involvement of an elected body (city, county, state). Usually this means that they (staff) are not going to take the lead on pushing anything remotely controversial. In this case, the “something controversial” is that several parking spaces would have to be removed. While that seems like a slam dunk trade-off to anyone on this forum, surely it is not desirable to business owners and driving customers who are just fine with the status quo.

Long story short, siting a station at 48th is an uphill battle, and no one here should expect Metro Transit staff people to be the leaders on an issue like this. They simply don’t have the political backing necessary for change. Leadership on these types of issues (transit improvement that impacts literally anything) has to come from elected officials and neighborhood orgs, and then maybe that position can become the staff position.
I reached out to Jeremy Schroeder since I live in Ward 11. I think it is important to serve all of those businesses.

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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby twincitizen » January 24th, 2018, 11:02 am

To put my lengthy comment more succinctly: There will not be a D Line station at 48th Street unless the City of Minneapolis (via the City Council) demands that there must be one. The lack of a station in the draft plan tells me that neither the local business association nor the previous City Councilmember (Quincy) asked for it.

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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby thom » January 24th, 2018, 2:39 pm

billhelm wrote:
January 19th, 2018, 2:49 pm
I know it's only 2 blocks from 46th but a little surprised they went with 52nd over 48th, considering it's a likely destination for some riders given the commercial node there.
The whole concept kind of falls apart on Chicago Ave between 46th and 56th. 46th is the major cross street so there should be a stop there, but there should also be a stop at 48th. 56th has the existing bus turn-around but 54th should also have a stop. Meanwhile, there's not really anything at 52nd. I know the idea is to only have a stop every four blocks to make it more like a train, but maybe the concept just isn't going to work for that particular area?

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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby mattaudio » January 24th, 2018, 2:58 pm

I'm not sure how many people would really transfer between the 46 and D Line... I'd rather see stops at 43rd, 47th, 52nd, and 56th. Slightly more than 1/2 mi spacing, but at least you hit the development nodes a little better.

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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby amiller92 » January 25th, 2018, 10:09 am

In a revolutionary change from the prior office holder, a Schroeder staffer responded to say they've looking into it.

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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby LakeCharles » January 25th, 2018, 10:22 am

Sorry if this has been addressed, but what will this line be called? The A-Line makes sense as the first, but it's going to be weird if these keep the letters they were proposed as, and not the order in which they were built.

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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby Bakken2016 » January 25th, 2018, 11:06 am

LakeCharles wrote:
January 25th, 2018, 10:22 am
Sorry if this has been addressed, but what will this line be called? The A-Line makes sense as the first, but it's going to be weird if these keep the letters they were proposed as, and not the order in which they were built.
A Line - Snelling Ave/Ford Parkway
B Line - Lake St/Marshall St
C Line - Penn Ave N
D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago
E Line - Hennepin Ave

The only reason B doesn't exist yet is because it was supposed to be West 7th in Saint Paul, but they decided to go with Modern Streetcar(cough cough it is basically LRT). So they skipped B to work on the Penn Ave N line and called it C, and when they decided Lake ST would have an aBRT the reassigned the letter.

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Re: D Line - Fremont/Emerson/Chicago Rapid Bus

Postby Bakken2016 » January 25th, 2018, 1:09 pm

amiller92 wrote:
January 25th, 2018, 10:09 am
In a revolutionary change from the prior office holder, a Schroeder staffer responded to say they've looking into it.
Same! Like many said Quincy was non-responsive.


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