Dinkytown

Northeast, Near North, Camden, Old St. Anthony, University and surrounding neighborhoods
Jomanji
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby Jomanji » June 4th, 2015, 10:01 pm

First time I ever saw a biker get "doored" was a block down from where this picture was taken.
It was a jarring sight and I avoided biking on Fourth ever since. Glad to see this improvement!

Viktor Vaughn
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby Viktor Vaughn » June 10th, 2015, 8:41 am

Dinkytown should get historic designation, says Historical Preservation Commission
http://www.minnpost.com/politics-policy ... tion-commi

twincitizen
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby twincitizen » June 10th, 2015, 9:13 am

Image

I'm ok with protecting everything* inside the smaller red boundary, as long as tall buildings on the surface parking lots are still allowed. (i.e. 17-story hotel behind Mesa/Camdi, matching height of The Chateau)

I'm not ok with protecting the properties only included in the black boundary (McDonalds, the Post Office, etc.)

*I'd like to see the rail trench and Property #20 excluded from any historic district as well. If anyone figures out how to replace those buildings with a taller structure or build some type of cap there, I'm all for it. It's probably very unlikely to happen due to cost, engineering challenges, etc...but I'd hate to create any additional barriers to more intense development there.

EOst
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby EOst » June 10th, 2015, 9:26 am

Agree about the red vs black districts; protecting the McDonalds (and its giant drive-through and parking lot) would be ridiculous.

I have to disagree, though, on the trench. In the long term, as rail traffic in the corridor continually declines (are there any users other than the coal plant by the river?) the trench has real potential to turn into a Greenway-style amenity for the neighborhood. Dinkytown has plenty of room to expand to the north, west, and east without capping this part of the trench.

twincitizen
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby twincitizen » June 10th, 2015, 9:38 am

Perhaps capping was the wrong word - how about "larger buildings at the developable corners"? I wouldn't want to see the trench fully covered either. Basically I'm saying that Property #20 and the trench itself (#35) should be excluded from the district. It just isn't necessary.

Wedgeguy
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby Wedgeguy » June 10th, 2015, 9:48 am

I have no problems with the red boundary. Mc Donald's is hysterical, not historical in anyway!! BIG NO VOTE FOR THE BLACK!

nBode
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby nBode » June 10th, 2015, 9:58 am

As a current student living in Dinkytown, the McDonald's is a part of the character of the neighborhood. It's a unique style (2 levels/lower level entrance, on the corner between bridges, etc.) as far as McD's go. It's certainly a staple for identifying the Dinkytown area. It's how you recognize that you're in Dinkytown when coming down 4th. I'd like to see it stay.

The surface parking, on the other hand, would be lovely to see developed.

RailBaronYarr
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby RailBaronYarr » June 10th, 2015, 10:21 am

We must protect our multi-national chain buildings in Dinkytown. They're a part of its history now.

grant1simons2
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby grant1simons2 » June 10th, 2015, 10:24 am

Some day McDonalds will be a historic landmark. Especially the way their stock and sales are headed now. At least their not blocking a major commercial road...

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FISHMANPET
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby FISHMANPET » June 10th, 2015, 10:42 am

The nice thing about the McDonald's building is that the drive through isn't really integral to the design or placement of the building. You could easily close the drive through if someone wanted to in the future. But I'd bet McDonald's would really not like that, I bet they get a ton of traffic from U employees stopping by for breakfast in the mornings.

But I think that people form an attachment to Dinkytown relative to basically when they were an undergrad at the U (even after being staff rather than student for 5 years, I wouldn't say my personal attachment to Dinkytown has changed much from beyond my undergrad). And not only is every person's attachment different, but people only a few years apart will have drastically different experiences, because Dinkytown is a rapidly changing place, and I honestly genuinely think that's a huge part of it's charm. But also some things are constant. Who among us hasn't ended up at least once drunk at McDonalds at 2 AM wondering why the dollar menu costs $1.50 etc etc.

Also I'd love if a parcel along the trench (the corner with 20 could be most likely) could be developed to include greater height but more importantly vertical circulation from the trench to street level. Can you imagine if there was a nice bike parking area down in the trench and then you come up to the center of this beautiful commercial district?

go4guy
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby go4guy » June 16th, 2015, 7:10 am

If any of you have been in Dinkytown on football game days, you have likely seen balconies of these new apartment buildings packed with people. I would always cringe walking by it, because it just didnt look safe. Last night, one of these balconies in Berkeley, CA on the Cal campus broke when 13 people where on it. Does anyone know what these kind of balconies are rated for? They are essentially just bolded into the framing, so it cant be all that strong.

RailBaronYarr
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby RailBaronYarr » June 16th, 2015, 7:21 am

Nick brought this up earlier: https://forum.streets.mn/viewtopic.php?f ... 220#p64995

I saw the article of that Berkeley incident and immediately thought of the Marshall.

seanrichardryan
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby seanrichardryan » June 16th, 2015, 8:20 am

They look a little different. https://goo.gl/maps/H1WVV
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mulad
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby mulad » June 16th, 2015, 10:06 am

On the topic of McDonald's versus the historic district, that "Dinkytown Uprising" documentary I mentioned a couple times seems pretty relevant. That was all about a protest in 1970 to try and stop the Red Barn burger chain from tearing down a site in Dinkytown to make room for one of their buildings. The McDonald's was two or three years old at this point. Red Barn already had one in Stadium Village (I knew it as the Lotus Restaurant when I was in college, though it's been torn down now to make room for The Edge on Oak).

Despite the protests, the building in Dinkytown eventually got torn down, though the Red Barn never went in. The protesters came back after the site was leveled and built a "People's Park", though I'm not sure how long that lasted. The Hennepin County property map dates the current buildings on the site to 1972, though I think that marks the start of construction (they're the Hideaway/Magus Books building and Dinkytown Post Office -- which explains the weird setback those two buildings have).

Mikey
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby Mikey » June 17th, 2015, 5:35 am

Still though, some minor historical event that took place on that site before the current buildings were built should not be used to protect those buildings.

If anything, it would be reason to rebuild a replica of what was torn down

I'd personally have no issue with limiting the height on this site to three stories to "better fit the scale of the street", but those god awful cinder block buildings need to go
Urbanist in the north woods

amiller92
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby amiller92 » June 17th, 2015, 12:39 pm

mulad wrote:On the topic of McDonald's versus the historic district, that "Dinkytown Uprising" documentary I mentioned a couple times seems pretty relevant. That was all about a protest in 1970 to try and stop the Red Barn burger chain from tearing down a site in Dinkytown to make room for one of their buildings. The McDonald's was two or three years old at this point. Red Barn already had one in Stadium Village (I knew it as the Lotus Restaurant when I was in college, though it's been torn down now to make room for The Edge on Oak).

Despite the protests, the building in Dinkytown eventually got torn down, though the Red Barn never went in. The protesters came back after the site was leveled and built a "People's Park", though I'm not sure how long that lasted. The Hennepin County property map dates the current buildings on the site to 1972, though I think that marks the start of construction (they're the Hideaway/Magus Books building and Dinkytown Post Office -- which explains the weird setback those two buildings have).
There is something really strange about grounding a historic preservation argument in a "historic" preservation protest.

Like, it wasn't historic until we protested to make it historic, which failed, but because we protested it's now historic. Okay.

mulad
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby mulad » June 17th, 2015, 5:57 pm

Well, I forgot a final paragraph or two -- I don't see the McDonald's as historic, even with its odd architecture. Show of hands for anyone who ever sat in the upper level of the building? Anyone?

The protests were partly fueled by a crazy combination of events -- the Kent State shootings occurred during this time, for instance. I imagine the McDonald's would have also seen very significant opposition of it had been proposed then instead of a few years earlier.

My feelings about the area still come down to the simple question of, "is this better than what it replaced?" I think a lot of the protesters of the time sounded a lot like today's Marcy-Holmes residents who don't like the new apartment buildings. Some of them didn't want anything torn down, even if they were ramshackle old homes.

I certainly don't want to see old streetcar node buildings get razed to make room for the typical fast-food joint with a donut of parking around it. But if a new building has more square footage and is taller and makes a proper street wall, then it's a much better idea.

Anyway, I'm much more in favor of the smaller historic district, if there has to be one at all. But Dinkytown has always been marked by change since I've lived in the Twin Cities, so there's very little of it that I think really deserves it.

xandrex
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby xandrex » June 18th, 2015, 3:38 pm

mulad wrote:Well, I forgot a final paragraph or two -- I don't see the McDonald's as historic, even with its odd architecture. Show of hands for anyone who ever sat in the upper level of the building? Anyone?
*raises hand*

I have. It's kinda nice as it's usually pretty quiet.

...but last time I was there, I saw several mice running around on the floor. So that was pleasant.

Mikey
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby Mikey » June 26th, 2015, 12:26 pm

It looks like common sense might prevail:
http://www.minnpost.com/politics-policy ... ts-dinkier
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exiled_antipodean
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Re: Dinkytown

Postby exiled_antipodean » June 26th, 2015, 6:29 pm

xandrex wrote:
mulad wrote:Well, I forgot a final paragraph or two -- I don't see the McDonald's as historic, even with its odd architecture. Show of hands for anyone who ever sat in the upper level of the building? Anyone?
*raises hand*

I have. It's kinda nice as it's usually pretty quiet.

...but last time I was there, I saw several mice running around on the floor. So that was pleasant.
I have also sat on top. Mice running around, huh? At least you know the meat was sourced locally.


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