Montage (Nye's redevelopment) - 116 E Hennepin Avenue

[xandrex]

The only difference would be if Alatus goes with condos versus rentals.

Back in December I was chatting with some folks who are in on the project and they seemed to think this was almost certainly condos.

[nickmgray]

This might be a stupid question, but why are there no project that are condo/rental? I know that the financial side of things changes based on the type of building it is, but why not build something and give people the option to rent of buy?

I'm sure I'm missing something that's very obvious.

[xandrex]

I think financing between condos and apartments is different, no? Banks are wary of condos until they've pre-sold enough units. And they don't seem to like condos being rented out either.

I'm sure there's an explanation, but all of these rules have struck me as odd.

[min-chi-cbus]

I know this much....there's a certain price-point a market or sub-market must reach before it becomes financially viable to build condos instead of apartments. This may be why you see more condo development in more expensive cities -- the revenues generated have to more than cover the investment put in, and as quickly as possible. Another thing I'm fairly certain of is that a) banks don't like risk and don't like getting paid over long periods of time, and b) condos provide a sure-thing investment whereas rentals take much longer to accumulate revenue. Condos are lower risk because the principal ($loaned) is paid back faster and to investors who are typically lower risk.

I'm not sure what that price-point is today though.

[twincitizen]

There were a couple lengthy pieces written in 2013 about why we haven't seen any condos:
http://finance-commerce.com/2013/07/des ... m-in-site/

http://www.minnpost.com/twin-cities-bus ... win-cities

Sherman said that he’s seeing existing units selling in the range of $250 to $300 per square foot, but he said that new construction would call for prices in the range of $335 to $400 per square foot.

Jim Stanton (Shamrock Development) is obviously doing his own thing, but that's at a rate of 100ish units every 2-3 years. Who knows when/if he'll move ahead on the Eclipse site (Washington & Hennepin). Great to see him take a chance on Downtown East in the interim though. Besides him there's the boutique 602 1st St N project, which is like 30 units. We'll see if the Alatus project turns out to be condos after all. There was an article saying they'd make that decision this month, so we should have an answer soon.

[go4guy]

This might be a stupid question, but why are there no project that are condo/rental? I know that the financial side of things changes based on the type of building it is, but why not build something and give people the option to rent of buy?

I'm sure I'm missing something that's very obvious.

Nick, great question. One of the main reasons I see is from the individual unit mortgage side. Most condo unit buyers must get a mortgage, and banks don't like these kind of projects. These are risky loans, as the condo association does not have full control of the project. The entity that would control the apartments would have too much power in the project, which makes this a riskier investment for a mortgage bank to back the individual condo units. And not very many projects are going to get enough pre-sale with buyers paying in cash.

[MNdible]

Yep. You could have a project that contained both rentals and condos, but they'd need to be subdivided in legally separate entities.

[go4guy]

Have there ever been any towers constructed in the US which have both rental apartments and condos in the same building? I have worked with condos in the entire country, and cannot recall ever coming across a new construction tower with both in the same tower. Have had two towers in one development with one being rentals, and one being condos, but never the same.

[Chef]

I posted this at SSC but I think it bears reposting here:

I hesitate to post rumors here because of all that has transpired, but I heard an interesting piece of information today about Nye's through the restaurant industry grapevine from somebody who would know. Apparently Nye's is closing because they were offered a check so big they couldn't say no, but they intend to reopen in their old buildings once they have been moved. It is likely that the story they put out was merely for public consumption.

[Anondson]

I don't begrudge anyone being handed a check that makes your eyes bug out. If they do intend to find a way back to their old buildings—maybe with a new rooftop patio(?)—then it feels like a win-win...

[Chef]

I tend to agree. If Nye's reopens and we also get a new tower on the block it is definitely a win-win.

[lorwest]

Have there ever been any towers constructed in the US which have both rental apartments and condos in the same building? I have worked with condos in the entire country, and cannot recall ever coming across a new construction tower with both in the same tower. Have had two towers in one development with one being rentals, and one being condos, but never the same.

I'm fairly certain the taller of the two Galtier Plaza towers has both condos and apartments. They are serviced by separate entrances and elevators.

[twincitizen]

Sorta getting off-topic, but Midtown Exchange has affordable apartments and for-sale condos, accessed by separate elevators in the main lobby near the Global Market entrance.

RE: Nye's reopening, I'm skeptical. If they planned to reopen, why not announce that from the very start? To give the business a shot in the arm in the short term? It seems odd to anger a bunch of people for nothing. I guess I could see how a shift in plans occurred, since they originally wanted to demolish the whole complex. But won't it not be Nye's, after they demo the 1-story buildings and squish the two historic buildings together?

[xandrex]

^They can spin it as Nye's having been "saved." They get the nostalgic crowd rushing in for more food and drinks in the short-term and have a chance to rebrand themselves a bit in the long-term (something's going to have to change with, what, maybe half the space from before?)

[Nathan]

http://instagram.com/p/ynXaNiudF_/

Just thought this seemed like a similar site and people might think it's as pretty as I do.

[David Greene]

I think the question on a new Nye's is, "what is Nye's?" Is it the polka mosh pit? Is it the dive bar? Is it the piano lounge? Is it the supper club? To me "Nye's" is all of it and I don't see that being created again. But I can totally see that a lot of people might consider "Nye's" just to be the corner bar and said mosh pit. I could see that part reopening.

[FISHMANPET]

Nye's is clearly the prime-rib sandwich and I'll fight anyone that says otherwise (no I won't).

[go4guy]

Dont forget the perogis. (I assume I butchered that spelling)

[seanrichardryan]

Pierogi /pɨˈroʊɡi/, (Polish pronunciation: [pjɛˈrɔɡʲi]; also spelled perogi, pierogy, perogy, pierógi, pyrohy, pirogi, pyrogie, or pyrogy in English

[FISHMANPET]

I think the takeaway is there's no wrong way to spell pierogi.