Subsidized and/or Affordable Housing

[Nathan]

This is a pretty interesting article... It shows Hen County doing a pretty good job, and getting better at a faster rate then a lot of other counties...

http://www.theatlanticcities.com/jobs-a ... rent/8539/

[grant1simons2]

And let's never ever do a "poor door" like they did in NYC

http://www.newsweek.com/new-york-city-a ... ing-260218

[Wedgeguy]

Yes I saw whee they are segregating the door to the affordable units that they had to put in for financial help.

[Anondson]

John Joe Schlichtman suggests one angle that the "poor door" may be the most egalitarian option for affordable housing the US can expect.

http://nextcity.org/daily/entry/poor-do ... sing-ideas

[Wedgeguy]

Have not seen this reported, but save some time on September 24th and 25th for the 2014 building community visuals and models. The displays will be back in the IDS Crystal Court atrium like last year. For those that missed last years, don't let this years go by without a stop, as there will be several displays of projects that we talk everyday about. This will include downtown, neighborhood and suburban project. There will be 8 major exhibitor showing several of their projects. We will see what they have to present for the Nicollet Mall redesign. There is an ad on page 3 of the Journal with further details. Hope you all make time to see!

[go4guy]

John Joe Schlichtman suggests one angle that the "poor door" may be the most egalitarian option for affordable housing the US can expect.

http://nextcity.org/daily/entry/poor-do ... sing-ideas

I have never lived in a condo tower, but I would assume that luxury condos/aparmtents have a door man, conceirge, and very high end finishings in their lobby. Wouldnt it then seem fair to have those paying considerably less to not get to have those added luxuries? What is wrong with a separate entrance for the affordable units? If you aren't paying the added cost of those luxuries, why should one expect them? As long as the doors look similar from the outside and dont make it obvious, I am just fine with this set up.

[Viktor Vaughn]

Why should poor people be allowed to live in the building at all? Maybe they shouldn't even be allowed to live in well appointed neighborhoods?

[IllogicalJake]

John Joe Schlichtman suggests one angle that the "poor door" may be the most egalitarian option for affordable housing the US can expect.

http://nextcity.org/daily/entry/poor-do ... sing-ideas

I have never lived in a condo tower, but I would assume that luxury condos/aparmtents have a door man, conceirge, and very high end finishings in their lobby. Wouldnt it then seem fair to have those paying considerably less to not get to have those added luxuries? What is wrong with a separate entrance for the affordable units? If you aren't paying the added cost of those luxuries, why should one expect them? As long as the doors look similar from the outside and dont make it obvious, I am just fine with this set up.

I've experienced a lot of projects with high-end market rate units and affordable units - never have I seen a case of "this lobby is for higher-paying tenants only, sorry."

[min-chi-cbus]

Have not seen this reported, but save some time on September 24th and 25th for the 2014 building community visuals and models. The displays will be back in the IDS Crystal Court atrium like last year. For those that missed last years, don't let this years go by without a stop, as there will be several displays of projects that we talk everyday about. This will include downtown, neighborhood and suburban project. There will be 8 major exhibitor showing several of their projects. We will see what they have to present for the Nicollet Mall redesign. There is an ad on page 3 of the Journal with further details. Hope you all make time to see!

Cool! I can't see any of this but I'm wondering if this is when some of the hub-bub around the Ritz Block (among other projects) will be revealed finally?

[David Greene]

Why should poor people be allowed to live in the building at all? Maybe they shouldn't even be allowed to live in well appointed neighborhoods?

Well, because it's their own fault they're poor, of course!

[go4guy]

I just know that in places like NYC, you PAY to have a doorman. And I am sure you pay for other items as well. But we are still getting the affordable housing built and in well to do neighborhoods. Not only that, they are quality buildings, and not cheap buildings that will only last 10-20 years. So if the developer feels this is what is needed to incorporate affordable housing with housing for rich snobs, then let them do it. And really, who cares if there are 2 entrances. Is anyone not living in the place going to notice? Some people act as if a mob is going to be mocking those going in the affordable housing entrance. Nobody will notice. And if you have ever been in NYC, you will notice that a lot of residential entrances are not flashy and are just random doors. Not seeing the big deal here.

[IllogicalJake]

I just know that in places like NYC, you PAY to have a doorman. And I am sure you pay for other items as well. But we are still getting the affordable housing built and in well to do neighborhoods. Not only that, they are quality buildings, and not cheap buildings that will only last 10-20 years. So if the developer feels this is what is needed to incorporate affordable housing with housing for rich snobs, then let them do it. And really, who cares if there are 2 entrances. Is anyone not living in the place going to notice? Some people act as if a mob is going to be mocking those going in the affordable housing entrance. Nobody will notice. And if you have ever been in NYC, you will notice that a lot of residential entrances are not flashy and are just random doors. Not seeing the big deal here.

Ah, class segregation – only a problem if people notice.

[go4guy]

I just know that in places like NYC, you PAY to have a doorman. And I am sure you pay for other items as well. But we are still getting the affordable housing built and in well to do neighborhoods. Not only that, they are quality buildings, and not cheap buildings that will only last 10-20 years. So if the developer feels this is what is needed to incorporate affordable housing with housing for rich snobs, then let them do it. And really, who cares if there are 2 entrances. Is anyone not living in the place going to notice? Some people act as if a mob is going to be mocking those going in the affordable housing entrance. Nobody will notice. And if you have ever been in NYC, you will notice that a lot of residential entrances are not flashy and are just random doors. Not seeing the big deal here.

Ah, class segregation – only a problem if people notice.

Would you rather have the alternative? Just build crappy, ugly affordable housing so everyone can complain about how ugly it looks? Or, why dont we just keep building projects and keep all the poor people in one area. Even better yet, lets just have the government pay for it all and build and manage it all on their own. That will show those developers.

[IllogicalJake]

I just know that in places like NYC, you PAY to have a doorman. And I am sure you pay for other items as well. But we are still getting the affordable housing built and in well to do neighborhoods. Not only that, they are quality buildings, and not cheap buildings that will only last 10-20 years. So if the developer feels this is what is needed to incorporate affordable housing with housing for rich snobs, then let them do it. And really, who cares if there are 2 entrances. Is anyone not living in the place going to notice? Some people act as if a mob is going to be mocking those going in the affordable housing entrance. Nobody will notice. And if you have ever been in NYC, you will notice that a lot of residential entrances are not flashy and are just random doors. Not seeing the big deal here.

Ah, class segregation – only a problem if people notice.

Would you rather have the alternative? Just build crappy, ugly affordable housing so everyone can complain about how ugly it looks? Or, why dont we just keep building projects and keep all the poor people in one area. Even better yet, lets just have the government pay for it all and build and manage it all on their own. That will show those developers.

You mention all these alternatives but left out the most obvious - just let everyone use the same front door.

Letting poor people into a lobby that has high-end furniture hurts nobody except those who don't like looking at or interacting with poor people. Do they have to have the same access to expensive amenities? Of course not. But don't dehumanize people by making them enter through a separate-but-equal door.

[go4guy]

Very true. But we are not the ones footing the bill for the project, and are not the ones buying the million dollar condos. Shouldnt they have the say? How is this any different than a gated community?

[go4guy]

Does everyone get access to the pool area? The rooftop patio? Conference rooms? All those other amenities?

[IllogicalJake]

Does everyone get access to the pool area? The rooftop patio? Conference rooms? All those other amenities?

No, at least not in the NYC example.

You're right.. there's no perfect solution, I suppose. But a lobby and front door aren't something I'd expect to have special access to, they're usually entry points for everyone. Making them suddenly special access for only rich people just feels asinine and unright. I feel like there has to be better ways.

[go4guy]

Does everyone get access to the pool area? The rooftop patio? Conference rooms? All those other amenities?

No, at least not in the NYC example.

You're right.. there's no perfect solution, I suppose. But a lobby and front door aren't something I'd expect to have special access to, they're usually entry points for everyone. Making them suddenly special access for only rich people just feels asinine and unright. I feel like there has to be better ways.

I completely see your point, and for the most part agree. But I think the thought is different in NYC. My brother lives on the UWS of Manhattan. He talks to me a lot about condos and apartments as they are searching for places to live, as that is part of my profession. One of the things I have noticed is how much they want a building with a doorman and a nice lobby. That is something you pay for there. He and his boyfriend are not at the point where they can afford a building with that amenity, but talk about how that is something they really want. So that is why I can see why different entrances may be wanted there.

[Wedgeguy]

Have not seen this reported, but save some time on September 24th and 25th for the 2014 building community visuals and models. The displays will be back in the IDS Crystal Court atrium like last year. For those that missed last years, don't let this years go by without a stop, as there will be several displays of projects that we talk everyday about. This will include downtown, neighborhood and suburban project. There will be 8 major exhibitor showing several of their projects. We will see what they have to present for the Nicollet Mall redesign. There is an ad on page 3 of the Journal with further details. Hope you all make time to see!

Cool! I can't see any of this but I'm wondering if this is when some of the hub-bub around the Ritz Block (among other projects) will be revealed finally?

If you go to Journalmpls.com and download the current pdf you can see the ad on page 3 and what they are possibly showing. I don't see Opus as being one of the major exhibitors. But that does not mean that one of projects is not the Ritz block. But I don't see it on the list. I'm sure once the exhibit opens there will be plenty of pics being posted here by urbanMSPer's.

[Nathan]

Does everyone get access to the pool area? The rooftop patio? Conference rooms? All those other amenities?

No, at least not in the NYC example.

You're right.. there's no perfect solution, I suppose. But a lobby and front door aren't something I'd expect to have special access to, they're usually entry points for everyone. Making them suddenly special access for only rich people just feels asinine and unright. I feel like there has to be better ways.

if the same builder built two buildings on the same lot, one market rate and the other low income, would they not have separate doors and lobbies? is it not cheaper and a more effective use of space/land to put both living functions into one building? isn't building an entirely different building for low income way more discriminatory? your argument has lots of holes.