Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

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Anondson
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby Anondson » July 12th, 2016, 2:46 pm

I understand waiting for more facts, and official stories can be whitewashes, but he gave an opinion. One a certain subset were made deeply upset about, but there are a lot of people today on all sides who get upset over opinions they disagree with and want it shut out from their claimed space.

I'm trying to find the magic hooks that keep conversations in real life on this from derailing. We're so unproductive, so many white people who don't see a problem take discussing it as a personal attack on their character, slamming shut any conversation.

amiller92
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby amiller92 » July 12th, 2016, 2:51 pm

Didier wrote:Just a random note, but I thought it was interesting how Gov. Dayton came out and made a judgement right away, rather than waiting for the official story. Naturally people were made uncomfortable by this, and there was some backlash. But that's basically what has made Donald Trump so popular: Speak your mind now, even if you have to change your opinion later.

Not saying it's right or wrong, but it's something you don't often see, particularly from Democrats.
What he said was blatantly obvious.

acs
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby acs » July 12th, 2016, 2:58 pm

No it wasn't, and in any case it was an unnecessary political risk. The people who liked what he said weren't going to support Dayton or any of his coming initiatives any less if he didn't tell them what they wanted to hear right then. In fact going too far probably hurt his chances of building support from across the aisle for no real gain.

MNdible
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby MNdible » July 12th, 2016, 3:01 pm

That Bob Kroll's sure a peach, huh?

mplsjaromir
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby mplsjaromir » July 12th, 2016, 4:20 pm

White people don't get murked for a busted tail light. He is absolutely right about that.

nordeast homer
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby nordeast homer » July 13th, 2016, 9:38 am

mplsjaromir wrote:White people don't get murked for a busted tail light. He is absolutely right about that.
I actually have.

Wondering if anyone else thinks the sit-in on the freeway this morning was a stupid place to block traffic. With its proximity to HCMC they're little game could quite easily become life or death for someone trying to get to the hospital.

mplsjaromir
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby mplsjaromir » July 13th, 2016, 9:49 am

You have not been killed for a busted tail light, unless you are a ghost typing.

amiller92
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby amiller92 » July 13th, 2016, 9:53 am

nordeast homer wrote:I actually have.
Being old/unhip, I'm not exactly sure what "murked" means, but based on context, one possibility is "shot dead by the cops," which I can say with confidence has never happened to you.

I once got pulled over for the light over the rear license plate being out (which it was not when I checked later). I had a black co-worker in the car with me at the time.
Wondering if anyone else thinks the sit-in on the freeway this morning was a stupid place to block traffic. With its proximity to HCMC they're little game could quite easily become life or death for someone trying to get to the hospital.
35W and University/the river is proximate to HCMC?

When these things happen, people really seem to overestimate the frequency of first responders on the interstate. It happens, but seems like they're much more likely to be on surface streets. Regardless, getting shot by the police is already a life and death situation.

LakeCharles
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby LakeCharles » July 13th, 2016, 10:02 am

Man, nordeast homer is way more intriguing now that I know he's been dead the whole time!

nordeast homer
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby nordeast homer » July 13th, 2016, 10:05 am

Yes, I am not dead. I misunderstood the term murked. I did have 4 cops pull guns on me when I was a janitor once, but obviously still alive...

I live near 3 nursing homes and several senior apartment buildings. Ambulances come and go what seems like hourly. They typically use Johnson to get on to 35 to get to HCMC. It is a very common route.

nordeast homer
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby nordeast homer » July 13th, 2016, 10:06 am

LakeCharles wrote:Man, nordeast homer is way more intriguing now that I know he's been dead the whole time!
I think people on here have wanted me dead, but no luck yet...

acs
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby acs » July 13th, 2016, 10:23 am

As for the location, this shouldn't be too hard to figure out folks. Look at the photo in the MPR story, look at the location.... University and 35w... Hmm I wonder where all these white SJWs came from?

Didier
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby Didier » July 13th, 2016, 11:39 am

I was very pro-protest, but acs changed my mind with that post.

Tyler
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby Tyler » July 13th, 2016, 11:48 am

It was probably his eloquent use of the unheralded term "SJW."
Towns!

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Mdcastle
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby Mdcastle » July 13th, 2016, 1:41 pm

So how many cops get murked by people they pull over for busted taillights vs the other way around. But regardless, suppose we stop using terms that require people to look them up in the urban dictionary.

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Tiller
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby Tiller » July 13th, 2016, 2:26 pm

I can't help but think of a time when my mom was driving me to school (like freshman year of high school, maybe 6 years ago now). Our car looked crappy/beat up as hell (cracked windshield and some other things). We were pulled over maybe 5 minutes from school because our "tabs were expired" (they weren't). We didn't have insurance at the time because $$$, but got off no problem. I'm thoroughly convinced that if we were black, like the officer probably assumed because of the condition of our car, that encounter would have gone differently, in a bad way. In this instance, of course, Philando Castile had a kid in the car too, though he wasn't white. :|

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Sacrelicio
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby Sacrelicio » July 13th, 2016, 5:42 pm

Mdcastle wrote:So how many cops get murked by people they pull over for busted taillights vs the other way around.
Why does it matter?

I don't understand the resistance to recognizing this as a problem.

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Anondson
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby Anondson » July 13th, 2016, 7:47 pm

How many people are saved by tail light citations?

Maybe we shouldn't be wasting police hours and risking interactions going sideways from an equipment out-of-order notice causing civilian murkings and police officer murkings period. Take a photo and send a bill to the address on file.

acs
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby acs » July 13th, 2016, 8:26 pm

Anondson wrote:How many people are saved by tail light citations?

Maybe we shouldn't be wasting police hours and risking interactions going sideways from an equipment out-of-order notice causing civilian murkings and police officer murkings period. Take a photo and send a bill to the address on file.
I get what you're saying but I wouldn't phrase it that way. It's more complex than that. 1st we all pretty much know the taillight isn't the primary cause of these kind of police stops. They are a way to get suspicious individuals to pull over and submit to an identification and visual check for probable cause. Whether or not that saves lives is another matter we can debate. 2nd, as an urbanist website we are generally pretty harsh on those drivers who run red lights, speed, drive erratically or generally put non-motorists in danger. Driving with broken tail lights is in the same general category as speeding and running a red light as far as police stops go. Do we really want to eliminate low level traffic enforcement from police duties when at the same time we push for lower speed limits and better safety measures?

EOst
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby EOst » July 13th, 2016, 8:34 pm

Mdcastle wrote:So how many cops get murked by people they pull over for busted taillights vs the other way around.
In the first half of 2015, four cops were killed "during a traffic stop or pursuit."

That's too many, and I think that it goes without saying that we should do everything we can to protect police officers from harm. But Philando Castile didn't deserve to be shot. Any system which condones and perpetuates shootings like his perpetuates injustice.


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