Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

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Anondson
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Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby Anondson » March 5th, 2016, 9:05 pm

Worth reading.

http://www.startribune.com/minneapolis- ... 371135461/
“Why would anyone from the black community want to go into law enforcement having to face that kind of barrage of vulgarity, not only toward themselves, but toward their family?” Moore recalled someone asking him recently.
:(

kirby96
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby kirby96 » March 10th, 2016, 11:26 am

Facebook posts critical of students are racist, BLM says

http://blogs.mprnews.org/newscut/2016/0 ... -blm-says/

WHS
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby WHS » March 11th, 2016, 1:18 pm

MPLS BLM still hasn't made a peep about housing segregation but they're sure upset about this tasteless placemat: http://www.startribune.com/joe-s-crab-s ... 371808201/

David Greene
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby David Greene » March 11th, 2016, 1:27 pm

WHS wrote:MPLS BLM still hasn't made a peep about housing segregation but they're sure upset about this tasteless placemat: http://www.startribune.com/joe-s-crab-s ... 371808201/
Jesus Christ.

Again, one does not have to have a plan for absolutely everything before being outraged by racism. BLM is grassroots. They focus on what they want to focus on.

Why aren't you going after the Sierra Club for not caring about golf courses?

And it's a bit more than, "a tasteless placement."

I mean COME ON.

I can't believe some people.

mattaudio
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby mattaudio » March 11th, 2016, 1:30 pm

I held off on responding to WHS because I figured David Green would share my feelings on it.

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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby mplsjaromir » March 11th, 2016, 1:47 pm

Why hasn't BLM affirmed my career???!???

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Tiller
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby Tiller » March 11th, 2016, 2:08 pm

I'm rather baffled on how this could have even happened. It just seems inconceivable, finding something like this in a public business. I guess there's a question of whether it was a lapse in judgement or "something else" about whoever is responsible. I think it's probably both, because even if he was a flagrant racist, it's still a lapse in judgement to bring that into public life.

Edit: unfathomable is the word I was looking for.

WHS
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby WHS » March 11th, 2016, 4:51 pm

David Greene wrote:
WHS wrote:MPLS BLM still hasn't made a peep about housing segregation but they're sure upset about this tasteless placemat: http://www.startribune.com/joe-s-crab-s ... 371808201/
Jesus Christ.

Again, one does not have to have a plan for absolutely everything before being outraged by racism. BLM is grassroots. They focus on what they want to focus on.

Why aren't you going after the Sierra Club for not caring about golf courses?

And it's a bit more than, "a tasteless placement."

I mean COME ON.

I can't believe some people.
Of course it's just a tasteless placemat. The company removed it, apologized profusely. It was stupid and now it's gone. Saying that Joe's Crab Shack is trying to "uphold white supremacy" just dilutes the term and makes people wary of the cause altogether.


This seeming inability to set priorities is doing REAL DAMAGE to the cause of civil rights by diminishing the credibility of civil right advocates. When the top headline on the Strib day in and day out is "Civil rights advocates protest random incident, declare Joe's Crab Shack a vestige of white supremacy," it turns off people who might otherwise be enthusiastic allies for social change. And when those people come out and express increasing skepticism over the tactics being used, you guys turn around and declare THEM the enemy rather than dare question the strategic decisionmaking at play. It's ridiculous.

EDIT: look, and to clarify, I don't think BLM or anyone else needs to advocate on every single issue. But there's a pattern here, which is chasing after individual wrong-doers, frequently of dubious culpability (I mean, that STP teacher MARCHED WITH BLM, for god's sake), demanding extreme measures and otherwise generating a lot heat, but not really addressing major systemic issues or otherwise adopting a process that's likely to get anything done in the long term. For people who have adopted social justice as social accessory this approach works as well as any, but if you actually want to see real policy change, it's hard not to be frustrated.

WHS
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby WHS » March 11th, 2016, 6:02 pm

And I guess the other thing I'd say is that a lot of this is probably the fault of the media - they facilitate it by giving more press to the one-off disputes than systemic critiques. But I'd strongly disagree that the correct response is to give the papers easily-packaged controversies over facebook postings or whatnot, which it sort of feels like activists have been doing more and more lately.

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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby Didier » March 12th, 2016, 9:34 am

I think it's worth noting that there are different local entities that represent the "BLM" banner, right? And it's that their goal, similar to Occupy Wall Street, to eschew central leadership? Someone please clarify if I'm mistaken here.

But my point being, the BLM protests in Minneapolis tend to come off as being much more effective than anything that Rashad Turner gets involved with in St. Paul.

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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby amiller92 » March 14th, 2016, 9:05 am

WHS wrote:This seeming inability to set priorities is doing REAL DAMAGE to the cause of civil rights by diminishing the credibility of civil right advocates. When the top headline on the Strib day in and day out is "Civil rights advocates protest random incident, declare Joe's Crab Shack a vestige of white supremacy," it turns off people who might otherwise be enthusiastic allies for social change. And when those people come out and express increasing skepticism over the tactics being used, you guys turn around and declare THEM the enemy rather than dare question the strategic decisionmaking at play. It's ridiculous.
If only they had you to tell them they are wrong.

WHS
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby WHS » March 14th, 2016, 9:58 am

Yeah, it's crazy I know, people having opinions on stuff that don't agree with yours. :roll:

acs
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby acs » March 23rd, 2016, 7:45 am

Racist, or just the cold hard truth? You can decide for yourself in the Theo Olson blog posts. Thankfully here we can at least have an open discussion without one side being shouted down and called "whitey" and "cracker".

http://www.twincities.com/2016/03/22/st ... vate-blog/

amiller92
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby amiller92 » March 23rd, 2016, 9:10 am

Can't really bring myself to care that much about the internet writings of one teacher and/or what happens because of them. I'll let others sort it out.

Didier
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby Didier » March 23rd, 2016, 9:56 am

I thought this comment on the MPR article posted atop this page was worth reposting here.
This is another case of multiple viewpoints being correct simultaneously, but we as Americans, insist only one viewpoint can be right, and that, more than anything else, is the problem with our society. Black Lives Matter is unjustly receiving far too much criticism because Minnesota does have some REAL racial disparities that should and must be resolved. A great state, like Minnesota, to live and work, raise a family and send them to school, should not look like the 1950's South when it comes to black unemployment and educational attainment or death and incarceration rates of young black men. The fear, anger, or even tired feelings some have expressed about Black Lives Matter SERIOUSLY IGNORES the evil that has befallen some of our native Minnesotans. Yet, obviously, there are problems at a few of Saint Paul's elementary and high schools. The Central High School fight occurring some months ago that resulted in a beloved staff member being so physically injured BY A STUDENT that he may have lifelong symptoms from an irreversible brain injury can never be tolerated or blythely explained away as "too few teachers of color," or "white teachers who don't know how to teach our children." There IS evidence some students enact a "fight or flight" response to simple directions, assignments, peer relationships, and administration. That TOO has a cause, and may take multiple advocates and multiple solutions. But we won't reach BLM's goals or the wishes of Saint Paul Public School Teachers if the two groups, and all of us, keep pointing fingers, giving our side of the story, or by being too afraid to hear what each of us has to say, and empathize with each other's frustrations. As JFK once said, "We all inhabit this planet. We all breathe the same air. We all cherish our children's future, and we are all mortal.

acs
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby acs » March 23rd, 2016, 10:01 am

amiller92 wrote:Can't really bring myself to care that much about the internet writings of one teacher and/or what happens because of them. I'll let others sort it out.
Fair enough.

kirby96
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby kirby96 » March 23rd, 2016, 10:38 am

amiller92 wrote:Can't really bring myself to care that much about the internet writings of one teacher and/or what happens because of them. I'll let others sort it out.

That's the right idea. Too bad St. Paul BLM doesn't share it. Instead the 'St. Paul Schools have Problems' argument has devolved into the 'Theo Olsen is representative of white bigot teachers' argument. A dubious assertion at best, and one I have a hard time seeing serves any benefit to St. Paul students (at least based on the evidence presented to date).

These specifically targeted accusations of white supremacy quickly become an eye-rolling Godwin's Law type of thing. As in, if St. Paul BLM declares you are a racist, it probably means you've won the argument.

LakeCharles
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby LakeCharles » March 30th, 2016, 10:55 am

No charges in the Jamar Clark killing case.

http://www.startribune.com/No-charges-a ... 373979481/

min-chi-cbus
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby min-chi-cbus » March 30th, 2016, 11:43 am

I'd like to see video or picture evidence....not just to pique my interest, but for everybody (naysayers and supporters alike) to see for themselves. I feel like that would help quell any potential violent reaction (regardless of the outcome of this case). If it were my son who was shot, It'd help to get some closure, and I know a lot of people feel like this is just another example of the system working against them. Wish I had something more enlightening to say.....not sure what I wanted the verdict to be, but it seems little has changed as a result of all of this (except the decision to skip the grand jury, which isn't nothing).

acs
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Re: Black Lives Matter, The Police, etc.

Postby acs » March 30th, 2016, 11:58 am

I do believe all the evidence is being released as we speak. Some of the videos are already on YouTube.

Edit: here it is. http://www.hennepinattorney.org/news/ne ... k-decision


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