Transit Crime

[SurlyLHT]

I've noticed that folks in North Mpls, seem to be taking Uber more to avoid transit.

[mplsjaromir]

People using Fent is caused by a clear and ever present ennui. Throwing people in jail or being somehow more punitive isnt going to change that. Sucks that there isnt a silver bullet.

[seanrichardryan]

Light rail hits car downtown
https://www.reddit.com/r/Minneapolis/co ... _downtown/

[Anondson]

The dash cam video was revealing! Showing the car clearing the crossing while the lights is still yellow the train coming through not slowing down.

[rhettcarlson]

What do we think here? Seems like clear LRV operator error given the westbound train was already stopped.

[BoredAgain]

What do we think here? Seems like clear LRV operator error given the westbound train was already stopped.

Either that or signal error. They will check for that and release a report.

[Nick]

https://www.minnpost.com/cityscape/2023 ... good-idea/

Bill has managed to be the first person in the media to describe how and why the turnstiles are physically not workable. Good work, Bill.

[Bob Stinson's Ghost]

If the only answer to the problem is putting an army of enforcers on the job we could be waiting for quite a while.

[UrbanMPLS]

While I agree that fare gates are not the answer system wide, they could be implemented where they’re most needed and practical (Lake Street seems like an obvious choice).

On a broader transit crime note, I was recently in Paris, London and Amsterdam and was astounded by how clean and orderly their systems were compared to the U.S. I took 30+ transit trips and only saw person who didn’t appear to be using the train to get somewhere. No smoking, no harassment, no drug use, no mental health crises, little to no garbage. I live in Chicago now, and I saw more bad behavior on my L ride (which has fare gates, I might add) to O’Hare than I saw on transit the entire trip in Europe.

I’m not exactly sure why that is (stricter enforcement, better social safety net, transit not being seen as a place of last resort, etc), but it sure made getting around easier and more enjoyable.

(Disclaimer: I know these systems aren’t perfect when it comes to safety and cleanliness, I’m just sharing my experience)

[VacantLuxuries]

better social safety net, transit not being seen as a place of last resort

I wish we could have a conversation around these things instead of having to convince people who never ride transit not to spend all our transit money on useless gates and fences. A majority of the issues with Metro Transit right now are failures of the state and federal governments to provide enough social services and housing, issues a transit agency has neither the funds nor ability to solve.

[BigIdeasGuy]

While I agree that fare gates are not the answer system wide, they could be implemented where they’re most needed and practical (Lake Street seems like an obvious choice).

This, just because a potential solution doesn't fit everywhere on the system doesn't mean where is does fit and work it shouldn't be dismissed automatically. If that means applying fare gates to all stations where they are feasible, Terminal 1 jumps into my head along with 46th Street, I think that's something Metro Transit needs to strongly consider.

[DanPatchToget]

For those of you supporting turnstiles I'd suggest using the subway systems in New York, Chicago, and San Francisco. There's a thing called turnstile jumping, and it doesn't take long to witness this in those cities. Turnstiles just make it more difficult for people, especially those with disabilities, to use transit. It's just not worth it whether it's some or all of our stations.

Sharing an experience similar to UrbanMPLS, for just over three months this summer I traveled to various countries in Europe and Asia. Long story short 99.9% of it was by transit. My only experiences seeing uncomfortable/unpleasant situations were a drunk guy on a bus in Copenhagen and a lady appearing to have a mental breakdown at Taipei's Main Station. When I returned to the U.S. I stayed overnight in Los Angeles and used their transit a few times where I witnessed people blasting music, a person only wearing underwear (a thong to be specific, that memory will be stuck in my brain forever), and people who don't understand the concept of inside voices. Granted Los Angeles is very different from the Twin Cities, but I've seen stuff like this happen here too. Just yesterday I took the Blue Line between Bloomington and downtown. On the northbound trip a guy was smoking, at 38th Street Station a guy was holding the door for 10 seconds, and a guy was being a little loud and obnoxious (though I appreciate his compliment of my e-bike). On the southbound trip a guy was smoking, a group of people were holding the door at Lake Street Station for 5-7 seconds, and a guy was blasting his music and decided to go to the other end of the train where a family returning from travels boarded at Terminal 2.

VacantLuxuries hit the nail on the head. These issues go far beyond transit, and transit shouldn't be blamed for this, nor should it hinder trying to improve/expand our transit system. I blame our government at all levels, as well as our selfish culture. In all of my travels I've never seen people with such a toxic level of selfishness as Americans (that isn't to say every American is a selfish jerk).

[Korh]

I am a bit worried that the social workers are one fubar being captured on film away from being scrapped like that viral clip from around 2017-2018 of a MTP officer asking if someone "was here legally" that got him and the agency as a whole in hot water for a year or two.

[Nick]

better social safety net, transit not being seen as a place of last resort

I wish we could have a conversation around these things instead of having to convince people who never ride transit not to spend all our transit money on useless gates and fences. A majority of the issues with Metro Transit right now are failures of the state and federal governments to provide enough social services and housing, issues a transit agency has neither the funds nor ability to solve.

Professional class liberals who think that handing out pamphlets will fix this issue will kill every single one of these people (who are rotting to death in public because they are unable to help themselves) if it means they have a chance at getting a do nothing project manager job at a politically connected nonprofit.

You know who sent ten million people to compulsory opioid treatment? Mao. Maybe that will help some people figure it out.

[mattaudio]

better social safety net, transit not being seen as a place of last resort

A majority of the issues with Metro Transit right now are failures of the state and federal governments to provide enough social services and housing, issues a transit agency has neither the funds nor ability to solve.

Are these issues any government agency could have the funds and ability to solve?

[VacantLuxuries]

I don't know, it's another one of those "this issue only happens in the United States" problems where other nations seemingly have solved the problem. Whether they've done that on purpose through dedicated programs, or by accident by not building society around a "if you're poor, you must have done something to deserve it so you don't deserve my taxes" mentality is anybody's guess.

The conversation around turnstiles and gates just feels like anti-homeless architecture or drug testing for welfare, yet another round of "We'll spend endless amounts of money to punish, to make society uglier, or to do pointless things that create the illusion of safety, but at even the mere suggestion we use that same money to fix root causes of poverty like education, food insecurity, housing insecurity, you're literally Karl Marx" thinking.

[Mdcastle]

Whatever turnstiles would cost would fix education, food insecurity, and housing insecurity?

[Tom H.]

Whatever turnstiles would cost would fix education, food insecurity, and housing insecurity?

Penny-wise and pound foolish.

[VacantLuxuries]

Whatever turnstiles would cost would fix education, food insecurity, and housing insecurity?

What a ridiculous standard of success. By that metric, the cost of turnstiles isn't even worth putting in turnstiles, because they certainly won't fix the problems groups like the Strib Editorial Board are claiming they will.

If the cost of turnstiles was $50 million, I'd rather have another aBRT route. If it was $100 million, two aBRT routes. We have a finite pool of transit money, I don't want to see it spent on security theater.

[Vagueperson]

Somewhat positive article on fare enforcement: https://www.startribune.com/fare-evader ... 600334669/

Does anyone know what the enforcement process actually looks like? If someone gets a parking ticket there is ostensibly a state-issued license plate on the vehicle that identifies someone who is trackable for payment. If they find someone on the light rail who hasn't paid and doesn't have any ID On them, what do they do? Or perhaps the person does have an ID but lies about having it and lies about their name? I just don't understand how people who don't want to pay are made to pay.