The center 2/3 or so of that side of the building is windowless wall, though.its employees' windows with quite stunning views of a cool new park and stadium.
Former Thrivent Building (now Hennepin) & Sora Apartments Block
Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
This proposal seems to be part of something larger. Or at least I hope. It doesn't make sense for Thrivent to simply add more parking capacity on this lot, unless it's part of a larger project which will have demands for the parking. Perhaps the skyway connections toward HCMC is a clue to something larger? The hospital and new building with the clinics would make the lot across the street a good location for some sort of Downtown Senior housing...maybe combined with condos or standard apartments to create something tall and notable? Wishful thinking perhaps. Maybe Thrivent is just making up for the parking lost by the ramp the city is taking down.
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- Stone Arch Bridge
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Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
Thrivent employees are telling me the new parking capacity here is to replace the parking capacity which will be lost on the block east of 5th Ave S when that is developed.
Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
Thrivant already has as many parking spots downtown on the land that they own. This project is the least that they have to do to consolidate all of their parking needs into their one half block so they can sell their other surface lots to developers (and make more money) it's a half ass job of creating an urban project so they can appease the city. They'd definitely just built a new parking garage if they could.This proposal seems to be part of something larger. Or at least I hope. It doesn't make sense for Thrivent to simply add more parking capacity on this lot, unless it's part of a larger project which will have demands for the parking. Perhaps the skyway connections toward HCMC is a clue to something larger? The hospital and new building with the clinics would make the lot across the street a good location for some sort of Downtown Senior housing...maybe combined with condos or standard apartments to create something tall and notable? Wishful thinking perhaps. Maybe Thrivent is just making up for the parking lost by the ramp the city is taking down.
If there is such crazy good opportunity on the next block east, this half block should be just as full of opportunity.
It's ok looking, but out of scale and hugely underwhelming.
Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
Edge of the downtown 'financial district' at best. Say what you will about parking, but financial districts need parking and relatively cheap parking is a competitive advantage for Minneapolis. Obviously there are substitutes to driving, but if your staff needs to pay $3600/year to park it can substantially impact employment and office location decisions.This is a lot in the heart of our downtown "financial district." They're proposing that it be used for a parking structure and 55 units of housing. That's not a win. Not in this location.This project looks like it checks a lot of boxes, including extending the heart of downtown further east, replacing some of the parking being lost from the office consolidation project, adds more downtown housing and it sounds like it might be a bit larger when finalized. A big win.
This lot is across the street from the ugliest high rise in the city, surface lots, and a really oppressive parking lot. Obviously, there's a lot of momentum eastwardly but it's still the low-rent side of downtown. If that changes, they could tear it down and build bigger. Newer buildings get replaced all the time.
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- Stone Arch Bridge
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Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
Their employees currently pay $0 per year to park. There's a lot of room between $0 and $3600. $0 is not the market clearing price of parking downtown.
Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
Get torn down? It's not getting torn down. It's 600 parking spots for thrivant... They wouldn't tear it down unless they had another 600 spots in the mean time. The ramp is there to stay and can't be added to because they aren't including an elevator core.
Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
Thrivent doesn't pay zero, it's an employee benefit that could otherwise be spent on salary. There's a lot of arguments about under-taxing private parking structures, and I agree with most of them.
My point isn't about Thrivent though, it's about parking supply in downtown in general. Parking is subject to supply and demand curves just like everything else. If we expand the amount of people downtown and reduce the amount of parking, assuming the same rate of parking consumption, prices will go up. We can assume fewer SOV commuters, but even Midtown Manhattan is a material percentage.
My point isn't about Thrivent though, it's about parking supply in downtown in general. Parking is subject to supply and demand curves just like everything else. If we expand the amount of people downtown and reduce the amount of parking, assuming the same rate of parking consumption, prices will go up. We can assume fewer SOV commuters, but even Midtown Manhattan is a material percentage.
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- Foshay Tower
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Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
You say that like it's a bad thing.If we expand the amount of people downtown and reduce the amount of parking, assuming the same rate of parking consumption, prices will go up.
Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
They do? Urban office districts served by transit are not typified by abundant parking.financial districts need parking
Regardless, we just built a huge parking structure on the edge of this particular financial district. It's literally never full during weekdays. It's where I park when it's raining and I drive to work.
Not it's not. Literally no one picks Minneapolis over another destination for business functions because of parking prices/abundance.and relatively cheap parking is a competitive advantage for Minneapolis
Seriously, if that's a priority, people will pick free parking in the suburbs, not slightly less expensive than it would otherwise be parking in the city (have you ever tried to plan events downtown for people who don't regularly visit?).
The only way that changes is by building good quality stuff there. This does not do that.but it's still the low-rent side of downtown
You think they're going to tear down essential parking??Newer buildings get replaced all the time.
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- Capella Tower
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Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
It was supposed to be a twin of the existing building, and mimic praying hands, IIRC....To be fair, the Thrivent tower's east face is *mostly a blank wall* because it was *designed for a tower to snug up against it.* https://goo.gl/maps/urLM2krPBG42
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- Stone Arch Bridge
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Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
Yep, now the other hand is "Ballard Operations" in a corn field outside Appleton, WI...
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- Union Depot
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Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
If this project needs variances, CUP's, etc. the city is under no obligation to approve them and is free to negotiate. If the project doesn't require any then the city has much less leverage.I'm guessing most, if not all, of these demands are not legal.No, try again.
That should be the city's response to this turd of a proposal. If they are going to insist on the 600 park spots they city should insist that apartments cover the entire exterior at a minimum if not higher and a decent amount should be Section 8/low income/workforce housing. Along with that the city should also require the sale and/or development of their remaining blocks otherwise they will face large property tax increases, being sure to not encourage another 222 Hennepin. Toss in a requirement to provide employees bus passes it could end up being a win for the city. There is a way to make this work for everyone if everyone comes to the table.
- FISHMANPET
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Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
If it needs variances there's no room to negotiate, that's not how variances work. If it needs a CUP, that gives the city a little more bargaining power but still not very much. So, for the most part, everything you're asking the city to demand is something the city has no legal basis to demand.
Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
Yes, I completely agree! It's definitely going to be combined with something VERY tall and VERY notable! Let's keep talking about how tall it is going to be and how notable it will be as well. ...On a scale of tall 7 being tall and 10 being very tall I think it's gonna be a 8,12,14. How tall do you think it is going to be Surly? Tall or super tall?This proposal seems to be part of something larger. Or at least I hope. It doesn't make sense for Thrivent to simply add more parking capacity on this lot, unless it's part of a larger project which will have demands for the parking. Perhaps the skyway connections toward HCMC is a clue to something larger? The hospital and new building with the clinics would make the lot across the street a good location for some sort of Downtown Senior housing...maybe combined with condos or standard apartments to create something tall and notable? Wishful thinking perhaps. Maybe Thrivent is just making up for the parking lost by the ramp the city is taking down.
Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
I'm trying to give them the benefit of the doubt. There's potential. Most likely it'll look like the Kraus-Anderson block. Given that United Properties can't get their Nicollet project off the ground and Ryan's office tower on top of the parking ramp hasn't said a peep in awhile the market here doesn't appear to favor the tall or super tall..but the 20 to 30 stories.
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- Union Depot
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Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
Okay so just say yes even though it's a underwhelming at best?If it needs variances there's no room to negotiate, that's not how variances work. If it needs a CUP, that gives the city a little more bargaining power but still not very much. So, for the most part, everything you're asking the city to demand is something the city has no legal basis to demand.
- FISHMANPET
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Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
Legally, yes.
There's nothing in the zoning code that says proposals have be a certain level of grandeur. Approving new buildings isn't a policy decision, it's a quasi-judicial decision that the plan meets all applicable zoning codes. If the building is allowed by zoning, the city legally has to approve it. Not doing so can open them to lawsuits.
So if you want better development downtown, we need to make sure our zoning code requires it.
There's nothing in the zoning code that says proposals have be a certain level of grandeur. Approving new buildings isn't a policy decision, it's a quasi-judicial decision that the plan meets all applicable zoning codes. If the building is allowed by zoning, the city legally has to approve it. Not doing so can open them to lawsuits.
So if you want better development downtown, we need to make sure our zoning code requires it.
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- Foshay Tower
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Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
And this is why the city should consider purchasing the poorest uses of land downtown and running the bid process themselves. It's expensive upfront, but the potentially lost property tax from a junk building (and lost potential residents/income tax/sales tax etc) adds up over thirty years. They can't do anything when they don't have a stake in it.
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- Stone Arch Bridge
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Re: Thrivent's Surface Parking Lots
Where's Nasa or June or RetiredBanker when you need them?!?
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